MTBA AGM- presidential vote

[Australia]

Australia, I agree. Hence why I have suggested MTBA explore the market of stage racing and marathon events. I believe some of these events (or a series of events) could potentially be run in the off season to offer year round opportunities that do not duplicate that already being successfully (in most cases) delivered by private promoters.

Thank you for your response Simon.

I admit to misinterpretting you when you first proposed an XCM series - I thought you meant something more along the lines of a long distance national series (i.e. focussed at the some riders who rip it up at the national xco series).

Obviously my belief that the presidency should be a two year term to give the president a fair dig at implementing their platform and seeing if the promised benefits are reaped ties me to Russ at this election.

In the future, if you were to propose an off-season XCM series* which
a) was aimed at the participation-focussed-racer
b) prioritised keeping entry fees low
c) didn't have all the unnecesary (and costly) pagentry that seems to follow the national series
I wouldn't have a choice but to vote for you (* the same could be done with a 4/8 hour enduro series)
Clearly, the implementation is key. If I were in your shoes and proposing such a scheme I'd be looking to encourage as man clubs as possible to follow the SCUM 30/60/90 model of low cost XCM events or Coffs Harbour CC's model of low cost short Enduros (usually 4 hours). Then all the MTBA has to do is keep a tally of series points.

-Andrew

 

[A.G.Thomas]

Who cares?

Changing a culture of an organisation is a long term proposition. MTBA is changing it is slow. Russ Baker has been preaching his line along with his fellow mates and they have achieved nothing.
They have left the MTBA administration. One can hope that Russ follows his supporters and leaves as well. He has achieved nothing this year. 60,000 members where are they, he preaches a lot and delivers as a politician does.
As a leader has alienated many.
Falsely claiming credit in his first post is not leadership, it plainly is a person taking credit for a reinstatement of funding that he actively contributed to it's with drawl.

Russ has helped getting 24hour racing a greater profile here and he is a legend in timing for our events - these are his strengths. (and note that he preaches much about non elite and non competition YET his main actions and attributes are about competition!!!!!) That's Russ - talking heaps and doing the opposite.

How many years has he ineffectively been on the MTBA committee?

I don't know Simon French - I do know a bit about leadership and the need for MTBA to have better leadership.

 

[DaGonz]

- Split the series into a gravity (DH and 4X) and trail (XC)...

...We can then run concurrent weekends if destinations are remote to reduce cost structures (i.e. two Victoria rounds back to back weekends, gravity one weekend, trail/xc the next).

Splitting the series I think is a good idea. W.t.f wants to race XC at venues like Thredbo?

- Explore the notion of an invite only 'pro tour/series' which has support races attached. This places our elite riders at the absolute top and allows us to develop more challenging courses that would otherwise exclude newer/lesser skilled riders.

I don't agree with that. I don't think you quite simply, have the market of "Pro/Elite" mtb-ers. Maybe in Downhill? There are some fantastic XC courses out there that get tougher the harder you push. Ourimbah in NSW is a classic example where even amongst the elite ranks you can see the cream of the cream ride lines you wouldn't believe, but still accessible and fun to the punter...

*shrug*

Cheers
Spoonie

 

[coach]

missing the point

Been riding since 1963 and still am hearing the same tune everytime someone wants to get elected or re-elected. Change Change and more Change. Fair Dinkum you guys carry on like you are going to create world peace or somthing. In my opinion what most of us want is to be able to just ride and every now and then go out and race our mates. The big problem with this is that we have to fork out over $200 bucks to get a licence then another $40 or bucks to get the MTB endorsement then we rock up and fork out a $100 bucks for a race entry. Alll this cost for just the odd race or two.

Everyone keeps saying that they want to increase membership and particpation but I don't think you realise just how many of us were invloved and are now sitting here on the sidelines because you have let it get way too expensive to get involved. Of course the official line is "well it cost us so much too insure you" ..... that is BS. I have my own insurance which is way beyond anything offered with a cycle or tri licence and at a third of the cost.

If you want my vote and my participation (and many other votes) ... cut the cost of getting licenced in half and membership and particpation will go through the roof.

As usual .... just some thoughts and ranting from the poor old brain of Coach.

Maybe I am wide of the point .... but I ride and hang out with a group of over 52 other guys and gals around my age who would be involved in a flash except for the pure cost of being bullied by officialdom.

Rant over

 

[DaGonz]

out over $200 bucks to get a licence then another $40 or bucks to get the MTB endorsement then we rock up and fork out a $100 bucks for a race entry. Alll this cost for just the odd race or two....

...If you want my vote and my participation (and many other votes) ... cut the cost of getting licenced in half and membership and particpation will go through the roof.

You're in luck. You can just get a mountain bike licence without the road for what, $85? $10-15 for the club membership generally, and then race at most clubs for $10-15 for an xco, or maybe $30-50 for an enduro...

that is what is happening *NOW*

or you can pay $15 for a day licence...

Cheers
Spoonie

 

[Josh Seksy]

You're in luck. You can just get a mountain bike licence without the road for what, $85? $10-15 for the club membership generally, and then race at most clubs for $10-15 for an xco, or maybe $30-50 for an enduro...

that is what is happening *NOW*

or you can pay $15 for a day licence...

Cheers
Spoonie

I wouldn't be a member of MTBA if you didn't have to have a license with them in order to race.

I wish there was some sort of cheaper - Race only license or something, money adds up!

 

[FR Drew]

And herein is the whole issue. MTBA regularly claims that they want wider membership and to represent all riders.

But, for most recreational riders, the insurance offers little to no benefit to them, they aren't interested in funding the bureaucracy or the elite racing and so what incentive is there to become members?

None.

Their best option is to remain outside of MTBA and only occasionally buy a day licence on the rare occasion that they do attend an event.

If MTBA want more membership they need to be offering more to riders, it's that simple.

 

[dinosaur_mtb]

Now I just ventured over to the MTBA site. It's bit of a dogs breakfast and navigation is a bit ho-hum. You need to dig into the membership tab to get the info wrt benefits,faq etc. But what is interesting is that Rotorburn is the defacto forum of discussion of matters wrt MTBA and there are no forums over there.....

From MTBA:
Joining MTBA


About MTBA

Welcome to Mountain Bike Australia (MTBA) Inc. MTBA is the new body for mountain biking throughout Australia, which is run by mountain bikers for mountain bikers. MTBA, as the nation's largest mountain biking association, serves as the national governing body for mountain biking throughout Australia. MTBA is an affiliated association with Cycling Australia defined, broadly, by a Schedule of Association.
MTBA is committed to the administration, promotion and development of mountain biking throughout Australia.
Since the birth of this sport in America, it has grown to have international stature. This is most clearly demonstrated by the inclusion of the Cross Country Mountain Bike discipline into the 1996 Olympic Games.
MTBA's Mission

MTBA has adopted the following statement as its mission and goal:
To develop and promote mountain biking in Australia for the benefit and enjoyment of all members


Benefits of joining MTBA


Why Join MTBA?

Some of the benefits of joining MTBA include:

• A national autonomous body for mountain biking
• National series that is raced all over Australia
• Cost effective membership
• Well priced day membership fees
• Rolling licenses (valid for 12 months from date of purchase)
• Flexibility in membership types (both recreational and competitive)
• All money collected by MTBA is returned to mountain biking clubs and riders
• Component of national membership is directed back to assist in state development initiatives
• Trails maintenance funding for states and clubs
• Works to keep trails open for all riders
• All members can race all MTBA events nationwide (club, state series, state championships, national series, national championships)
• Day membership for all categories and races which carry series points
• Each rider will receive a membership booklet and card
• Works to promote the sport to the general public through its contacts with the media
• Markets the sport to sponsors and television

You can take out as many day membership permits as you like but there are some pretty good reasons why na full 12 month membership is better:

• You get additional insurance coverage – income protection and non-medicare cover - at sanctioned MTBA activities by being a full MTBA member.
• You only have to fill in forms once every 12 months instead of at every event, saving you time and the club volunteer’s time in administration.
• $5 of every full MTBA membership goes towards a trail access fund. This fund has helped to finance IMBA visits to Australia, attending Tracks & Trails Conference and lobbying Local and State Governments.
• $7 (senior) and $5 (junior) of your full MTBA membership goes towards the State Development Fund (SDF). In 2007 over $39,000 of SDF is available for developmental initiatives in Australia!
• A full MTBA membership can be used at events held by any other affiliated MTBA club throughout Australia, including at state or national level. You can even accrue UCI points at selected national level events!
• Lastly, a full MTBA membership saves you money – for a junior if you participate in just 4 or more events or for a senior if you participate in only 5 or more events in 12 months you save!

 

[FR Drew]

The bits in the brackets folks...

Why Join MTBA?

Some of the benefits of joining MTBA include:

• A national autonomous body for mountain biking
  (As a recreational rider, who cares?)
• National series that is raced all over Australia
  (Again, of little to no relevance to recreational riders)
• Cost effective membership
  (Arguable at best given what a recreational rider gets)
• Well priced day membership fees
  (don't need them at all if you're a member, so why list this as a benefit of membership???)
• Rolling licenses (valid for 12 months from date of purchase)
  (who cares?)
• Flexibility in membership types (both recreational and competitive)
  (yawn)
• All money collected by MTBA is returned to mountain biking clubs and riders
  (or insurance companies and admin expenses, look at the financial breakdown from previous AGM's if you can find it on the MTBA website...)
• Component of national membership is directed back to assist in state development initiatives
  (finally, something useful maybe)
• Trails maintenance funding for states and clubs
  (some, but not much, most trails work is done by volunteers with little to no support from MTBA and most MTBA formal assistance is user pays to clubs)
• Works to keep trails open for all riders
  (mostly done by clubs, not by MTBA)
• All members can race all MTBA events nationwide (club, state series, state championships, national series, national championships)
  (as a recreational rider am I supposed to care?)
• Day membership for all categories and races which carry series points
  (yawn, racing stuff...)
• Each rider will receive a membership booklet and card
  (woo!)
• Works to promote the sport to the general public through its contacts with the media
  (okaaaay... again, most media releases I know of have come from clubs and have little to nothing to do with MTBA)
• Markets the sport to sponsors and television
  (oh.)

You can take out as many day membership permits as you like but there are some pretty good reasons why na full 12 month membership is better:

• You only have to fill in forms once every 12 months instead of at every event, saving you time and the club volunteer’s time in administration.
• $5 of every full MTBA membership goes towards a trail access fund. This fund has helped to finance IMBA visits to Australia, attending Tracks & Trails Conference and lobbying Local and State Governments.
  (IMBA visits were user pays for the clubs, so is attending tracks and trails)
• $7 (senior) and $5 (junior) of your full MTBA membership goes towards the State Development Fund (SDF). In 2007 over $39,000 of SDF is available for developmental initiatives in Australia!
  (Okay 12 dollars of my membership being used for regular riders, trails access etc, I'm all for that...)

Aside from being the self proclaimed umbrella body for MTBA, lets face it, MTBA exists primarily to cover the sports side of the activity and has minimal relevance to recreational riders or folks who only ride one or two events casually a year.

Most clubs do great stuff, but not at the behest of or because of the existence of MTBA.

 

[Cypher]

Is there a annual report for the activities undertaken by the MTBA?

I have had a quick look at the strategic directions (you can find it here)

It is hard to tell what happened and what didn't. From a superficial view of the website and my experience from being an MTBer for a while, I don't seem to have noticed that many of these things happened. I could be wrong though

 

[normdouglas]

The bits in the brackets folks...



Aside from being the self proclaimed umbrella body for MTBA, lets face it, MTBA exists primarily to cover the sports side of the activity and has minimal relevance to recreational riders or folks who only ride one or two events casually a year.

Most clubs do great stuff, but not at the behest of or because of the existence of MTBA.

So what are you going to do about this? Don't blame the organisation... rather blame the people running it.
If you don't like it get involved. This years AGM nominations received not one single NEW nominee.
I was determined to stay out of this conversation, but I need to comment now.
People, stop blaming MTBA for not being what you wish it was. It's a member DRIVEN organisation... therefore it needs it's members to get involved to create change.
Don't critisise those people who have at least attempted this.

 

[FR Drew]

Norm,

I could put my money where my mouth is and return to being a paid up member of MTBA, hop on the MTBA committee and try and change things, sure. Maybe that's what is needed, a whole wad of folks who are fed up with the status quo.

Instead I work hard within my local club on trails advocacy and frankly, from what I can see, that gets very little MTBA support at all. (Yes, I know IMBA Australia has been floated, but that's intended to be fully user pays too)
I buy a day licence about once a year for the odd occasion when I want to do a race like the Mont or the Scott for a bit of fun.

MTBA claims to be a lot of things, and as far as promoting the racing side of the sport, I don't think they're doing a bad job, but the non-racing side of the sport comes way down the list of their priorities.

 

[coach]

prices are wrong

Straight from the MTBA site ............

Senior Membership = not $85 but in fact $100 x me and the missus = $200 per year

1 Day Licence = not $15 but in fact $20 x me and the missus = $40 per event

Maybe it's just me but I can't find a single XC MTB race with an entry fee of less than $77 and Enduro MTB below $110 so........

A days XC racing for me and the missus = minimum of $194 for the entry and one day licence ....... and still the same price if we bought a licence and did less than 5 races a year ......... there's ya problem. The sport has simply become too expensive for us poor bastards.

If you could do a local club race for say $20 entry and $5 for a day licence then maybe a few more of us would turn up as then we would only be forking out $50 (not $194) for us both to have a day of fun.

This is why we hold our own regular XC races (and have done so for years). We get good fields and it cost people next to nothing to race twice on the same day. And before the officialdom start bleating about insurance and the like ... I again repeat, I have insurance coverage way better than CA or MTBA or TA provide and at a third of the cost. In fact you try to make a claim on the insiurance package that CA and MTBA and TA and watch how little it provides.

Anyway just my poor old silly brain at work ...... maybe I have got it all wrong??

If you have local cheap club racing going on then let us know about it.

 

[LurvsMTB]

If you have local cheap club racing going on then let us know about it.

Slightly off topic, but yes there a HEAPS of races less than $77 for entry.

Don't know where you live, but I pay 15 bucks for club three hour enduro, and infact $15for all races, except a 'special' enduro event, which is fine. The Vic enduro series is somthing like $50 per rider to enter, again not bad value. A load of organisation and volunteer hours go into preparing an event, their MTB club should be rewarded for that.

Cheap events are about, just look.

Can't help with membership fees though, but $100 odd sound reasonable to me if you get out do something with the club every couple of months, otherwise stick to day licences.

Edit.. just looked.. you live Brissy, surely local clubs are about that do cheap events...

 

[thecat]

Maybe it's just me but I can't find a single XC MTB race with an entry fee of less than $77

We do mid week afternoon races. Entry fee is $5. Bargain

 

[alchemist]

Edit.. just looked.. you live Brissy, surely local clubs are about that do cheap events...

http://caffeinefuelledcyclemania.blogspot.com/2011/02/bsmc-summer-seriesclubs-keeping-sport.html

 

[Cuthbert]

Interesting read so far....

For the average recreational rider who does not race it seems the only real relevance MTBA could have to them is in the realm of trail advocacy. In my view MTBA has, in the past, been focussed primarily on racing (well, lets face it - this is its main charter) and hasn't done a hell of a lot (read bugger all) in the advocacy department. So, I guess this is a question to both Simon and Russ...

Do you beleive it is MTBA's role to have greater involement in trail advocay work or is this best left to IMBA Australia?

If yes, do you realistically have the resources to have greater involvement and would it come at the expense of the time/effort spent on racing?

And again, if yes, how would you see MTBA being more involved?

 

[Turner_rider]

Opinion only, but I don’t see that MTBA does anything for recreational mountain bikers at all. I see local councils and state governments doing a lot in this space but MTBA appears to be invisible and always has been. I think as an organisation MTBA would be better off narrowing their scope and focusing on doing something really well rather than a little bit of everything poorly.

Even on a basic level it still takes my membership card 6 weeks to get to me when I renew online, which doesn’t give me a lot of confidence in the organisations ability to deliver a quality product as a whole.

 

[Josh Seksy]

And unless you buy it in december the year before, they jibb you for less then 12mnths membership, at the same price!

 

[dinosaur_mtb]

Questions for Candidates

So Cuthbert raises some questions for our candidates. Have you any others you'd like to add:

1. Do you believe it is MTBA's role to have greater involvement in trail advocacy work or is this best left to IMBA Australia?
2. If yes, do you realistically have the resources to have greater involvement and would it come at the expense of the time/effort spent on racing?
3. And again, if yes, how would you see MTBA being more involved?
4. In light of the fact that many (if not the majority of) MTB riders will only ever race in enduros, 24hr events, marathons etc which are promoter run, and profits returned to the promoter, what role if any does the MTBA have other than providing an avenue for insurance?
5. .........
6. ..........
7. fill in the gaps with your questions.