Little Things You Hate

The Duckmeister

Has a juicy midrange
Daughter weighs less.
I know power is capped, but is battery power? At Enduro nationals, Josh Carlson had the fanciest new giant eBike. Were the battery use and life the same as the other schmucks?
I honestly don’t know how these things can be compared. You could argue it’s the same with the quality, weight and spec of regular bikes...but is it? I don’t know.
I presume you mean battery capacity. Batteries don't have a power rating as such, they have an output voltage, which if my memory of Year 8 electrical science, which was longer ago than I care to think about, is correct is basically the pressure of the electric charge. Different e-bike systems may be designed to run on different voltages, but in the grand scheme of things ois neither here nor there. The drive unit is legally capped at 250 watts maximum power output, which means the only remaining variable is how much charge the battery can hold. A 400 watt-hour battery has enough charge to sustain a 400W power draw form one hour, or a 1W power draw for 400 hours, or anything in between (or beyond) on a directly relative scale. A higher capacity battery doesn't alter the power output, that's governed by the power unit itself, it just allows you to run further on a charge, or be a bit less frugal on the boost. Basically, it's a bigger fuel tank.
 

moorey

call me Mia
I presume you mean battery capacity. Batteries don't have a power rating as such, they have an output voltage, which if my memory of Year 8 electrical science, which was longer ago than I care to think about, is correct is basically the pressure of the electric charge. Different e-bike systems may be designed to run on different voltages, but in the grand scheme of things ois neither here nor there. The drive unit is legally capped at 250 watts maximum power output, which means the only remaining variable is how much charge the battery can hold. A 400 watt-hour battery has enough charge to sustain a 400W power draw form one hour, or a 1W power draw for 400 hours, or anything in between (or beyond) on a directly relative scale. A higher capacity battery doesn't alter the power output, that's governed by the power unit itself, it just allows you to run further on a charge, or be a bit less frugal on the boost. Basically, it's a bigger fuel tank.
I don’t know what I mean.

‘tank’ was more the question. A higher capacity battery in a race, surely means you can run more boost time and get an advantage. Ebike racing still seems silly, and fraught with complications and potential inequality to me.
 

bear the bear

Is a real bear
I presume you mean battery capacity. Batteries don't have a power rating as such, they have an output voltage, which if my memory of Year 8 electrical science, which was longer ago than I care to think about, is correct is basically the pressure of the electric charge. Different e-bike systems may be designed to run on different voltages, but in the grand scheme of things ois neither here nor there. The drive unit is legally capped at 250 watts maximum power output, which means the only remaining variable is how much charge the battery can hold. A 400 watt-hour battery has enough charge to sustain a 400W power draw form one hour, or a 1W power draw for 400 hours, or anything in between (or beyond) on a directly relative scale. A higher capacity battery doesn't alter the power output, that's governed by the power unit itself, it just allows you to run further on a charge, or be a bit less frugal on the boost. Basically, it's a bigger fuel tank.
I think this is comparable to arguments about lights, why would you pay more when you can buy an off-brand light from china for a 1/3 of the price.
The other 2/3 pays for.... the controlling tech, quality of the battery, luminaires, etc.
@moorey question appears to be, if you pay more do you end up with a better quality battery, wiring, control software etc or is the tech currently level across all manufacturers
 

The Duckmeister

Has a juicy midrange
I don’t know what I mean.

‘tank’ was more the question. A higher capacity battery in a race, surely means you can run more boost time and get an advantage. Ebike racing still seems silly, and fraught with complications and potential inequality to me.
Basically yeah, but on the flip side, assisted speed is still maxed at 25 km/h - any faster you're doing all on your own!. But yes, greater capacity means either longer run time before needing to change batteries, OR greater use of boost if event duration isn't likely to be too much concern for charge span.
 

SummitFever

Eats Squid
eBike racing will remain a joke while it is impossible to police de-restriction, power output etc.

eBike racing could be less of a joke if all competitors had to use the same "control" battery (ideally batteries handed out by the organisers to the competitors on the starting line). This would mean everyone is racing with the same amount of energy and it wouldn't matter how de-restricted or powerful the motors were. Part of the race-craft would be decided when and how much assist to use.
 

Flow-Rider

Burner
E-bike racing is big in Europe, popular in Italy but pretty much like motor racing. Not hard to hook up a cheat switch or modify the motor windings and low friction bearings etc..
 

moorey

call me Mia
eBike racing will remain a joke while it is impossible to police de-restriction, power output etc.

eBike racing could be less of a joke if all competitors had to use the same "control" battery (ideally batteries handed out by the organisers to the competitors on the starting line). This would mean everyone is racing with the same amount of energy and it wouldn't matter how de-restricted or powerful the motors were. Part of the race-craft would be decided when and how much assist to use.
Enduro Nationals allowed a battery change at mid point. :rolleyes:
 

fatboyonabike

Captain oblivious
so if someone turns up at an XC race on a 3kg bike, are they cheating because everybody else is riding bikes 2 or 3 times that weight?
or a DH racer that turns up with 1 ft of travel at each end, the rider still has to ride the damn thing!
its horses for courses..those that want to push the technology will be rewarded by podium places, and that is what bike companies wan to see!
the sport is still in its infancy, and they have a lot of things to still work out, but I for one are waiting with baited breath for proper Eracing to be one day a televised event...a fine blend of XC climbs at speed, Enduro obstacles and DH gravity blasting
 

bear the bear

Is a real bear
so if someone turns up at an XC race on a 3kg bike, are they cheating because everybody else is riding bikes 2 or 3 times that weight?
or a DH racer that turns up with 1 ft of travel at each end, the rider still has to ride the damn thing!
its horses for courses..those that want to push the technology will be rewarded by podium places, and that is what bike companies wan to see!
the sport is still in its infancy, and they have a lot of things to still work out, but I for one are waiting with baited breath for proper Eracing to be one day a televised event...a fine blend of XC climbs at speed, Enduro obstacles and DH gravity blasting
XC bikes are still governed by the UCI's weight limit of 6.8kg...
 

SummitFever

Eats Squid
... I for one are waiting with baited breath for proper Eracing to be one day a televised event...a fine blend of XC climbs at speed, Enduro obstacles and DH gravity blasting...
It'll be boring. DH is exciting to watch as well as the DH bits of Enduro. XC is exciting because of the fitness and finess involved to ride an XC bike.

eBike racing is like selecting all of the lame bits from moto and cycling and putting them together as one big snore fest. ie. much slower than a moto on the way up and slower than proper DH on the way down. To make it exciting, speeds would have to be moto-like, so why not just watch moto racing? Indeed, moto enduro racing offers exactly what you're talking about but the viewing numbers are low. Even than is too lame to get a big audience. What does get the eyeballs? Hard enduro, trials and MX. All mind-blowing compared to some peanut riding up an XC climb at 25km/h.
 

fatboyonabike

Captain oblivious
It'll be boring. DH is exciting to watch as well as the DH bits of Enduro. XC is exciting because of the fitness and finess involved to ride an XC bike.

eBike racing is like selecting all of the lame bits from moto and cycling and putting them together as one big snore fest. ie. much slower than a moto on the way up and slower than proper DH on the way down. To make it exciting, speeds would have to be moto-like, so why not just watch moto racing? Indeed, moto enduro racing offers exactly what you're talking about but the viewing numbers are low. Even than is too lame to get a big audience. What does get the eyeballs? Hard enduro, trials and MX. All mind-blowing compared to some peanut riding up an XC climb at 25km/h.
people watch road racing by the 10's of 1000's!...
 
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