Bruce Ridge ACT

[No Skid Marks]

I couldn't be 100% but it looked like the mini DH section at Bruce Ridge is one of the sections to be sacrificed. I always took the rough as guts b-lines but loved that section of trail.

I'll honour the closure for the greater good it but it will be a shame to see it go. It didn't seem to get that much use anyway.

Agreed, great shame. Apparently for good reason. Should be rebuilt elsewhere at Bruce by people who ride that sort of thing. The whole place needs a can of whoop arse opened up on it. It's all a lot tamer and generic compared to the soul of the original trails there IMO. More berms JUMPS, real jumps, and Flowy fast rhythmic corners.
My hand is up to do work with like minded people.
Not saying what's there isn't good, just very tame and predictable. Seems it's more for road riders with MTBs than MTBers for the thrill of it.
There said my bit. Hope something other than offense gets taken from it.

 

[Kramer]

Yes, unfortunately we have agreed to close the top and middle sections of the current descent trail. The main reasons were:
- significant erosion occurring in the middle section;
- dangers presented to other users from the high speed road gap (I have almost collected walkers & riders here);
- need to conserve the valuable ecology on the southern side of the ridge (primarily orchids and birds in this area).

However, the plan is to build a new descent trail using the current trail that runs parallel to the north side to the top fire road. It will cross to the south side and hook onto the lower section of the current descent. In building a new technical trail, we will need significant negotiations with PCS about what level of risk is acceptable. One advantage we have is that the ACT Govt is continuing to create facilities with potential user risks but with limited public liability (eg. Gungahlin DJs, and the new Melrose pump/skills track). Other challenges will be the construction of technical features - as we can't build anything out of wood; dirt and rock for jumps and berms should not be brought in from offsite, and is tricky to source onsite without impacting other areas; jumps or drops would have to be rollable (no doubles/gaps).

As much as we want some crazy DH/FR trails, this is not our land, and the land owners (PCS) have a conservative stance on risk. So the change over the last few years is not that we have a bunch of roadies running the show, it is that we are moving from illegal trails to legitimate approved trails that have been endorsed by the land owners.

Great to see some passion here - if only the passion behind keyboards translated to passion behind shovels.

 

[johnny]

Well my calendar is free for the 29th to put some work in. I think that was the next work day. Should consider putting up signs around the trail to encourage others to come build as well.

 

[nak]

It's been years since the public consultation and the plans for the trail network have changed a fair bit since that time also. Given the current closure of a lot of trails (one of my regular loops has had a truckload of branches dumped on it this week)and as you mentioned the plans for directional signage etc IMO an info /discussion session for all interested parties would be beneficial

 

[No Skid Marks]

Yes, unfortunately we have agreed to close the top and middle sections of the current descent trail. The main reasons were:
- significant erosion occurring in the middle section;
- dangers presented to other users from the high speed road gap (I have almost collected walkers & riders here);
- need to conserve the valuable ecology on the southern side of the ridge (primarily orchids and birds in this area).

However, the plan is to build a new descent trail using the current trail that runs parallel to the north side to the top fire road. It will cross to the south side and hook onto the lower section of the current descent. In building a new technical trail, we will need significant negotiations with PCS about what level of risk is acceptable. One advantage we have is that the ACT Govt is continuing to create facilities with potential user risks but with limited public liability (eg. Gungahlin DJs, and the new Melrose pump/skills track). Other challenges will be the construction of technical features - as we can't build anything out of wood; dirt and rock for jumps and berms should not be brought in from offsite, and is tricky to source onsite without impacting other areas; jumps or drops would have to be rollable (no doubles/gaps).

As much as we want some crazy DH/FR trails, this is not our land, and the land owners (PCS) have a conservative stance on risk. So the change over the last few years is not that we have a bunch of roadies running the show, it is that we are moving from illegal trails to legitimate approved trails that have been endorsed by the land owners.

Great to see some passion here - if only the passion behind keyboards translated to passion behind shovels.

It's very possible to build a safe but DH worthy trail. If anyone would like to help, please PM me. Happy to adhere to all requirements. No need to do anything to damage the bush or wildlife at Bruce. By having features such as rock gardens or bumps before corners and steep bits, it is easy to control people breaking and causing erosion. Table top jumps are also easy to build. So is getting the dirt needed by removing a large section of top soil. Using the clay, rock, sand etc below, and replacing top soil so that at worst all that is left is a large shallow wallow. This can be built next to the track in a safe area, so that track run off will run into it, silting it up, filling it over time. The track would need rough parts to discourage novices from riding it, so as jumps that have to be tables are not skidded flat. All easily achievable with stutter bumps, logs and rock gardens. An over 1 minute DH track worthy of big bikes is needed there and desired by the public. It can be built there. Otherwise illegal tracks and features will be built there and elsewhere. Everything would be built large enough to discourage modifications or other work. Having access to a machine for a day to just pile dirt up if nothing else, would make it a lot quicker. The track could be started from bottom up to avoid bush damage from people blazing off an unfinished track.
Please PM me anyone who is keen.
I am also keen to help spice up the existing tracks with "safe" environmentally friendly, appealing features.
I am not scared to dig and have come to one working bee. I do have to manage my time though as I lot of life's challenges like kids, foster kids and work. This all makes it hard to attend scheduled working bees. I am happy to build/repair/ fix sections by myself with permission, to be judged and proven.
Seems there is a bit of fear about doing it wrong and loosing our privilege of what we have. It is justified, but not necessarily necessary.
Keen as. Please don't let my desires for fun tracks take the wind from anyone else's sails. Good stuff has been made at Bruce without doubt already. It's just I feel anywhere with legal tracks should also cater to those that like gravity orientated tracks if they have any elevation.
Signage may be tricky. I like the faster flowy down sections for climbing, and the longer twisty stuff for descending. I've ridden with others there that ride it all the opposite way.
I guess people will adopt whatever signage says, and I'm happy to use the fire roads for accents anyway.

 

[mattg_ACT]

Hey All,

Long time watcher of this thread to keep up with what is being said about Bruce Ridge.

I live nearby and have taken people up there riding a few times over the years. That said, we never seem to really get into it and end up going back to Stromlo.

We like riding big bikes, and there just isn't enough up at Bruce to warrant pushing them up there.

It would be awesome to change this - I would love to be able to use my DH rig of a weeknight after work for a quick few runs up there.

That said, I also like riding route two at Stromlo on smaller trail bikes... There are some good features on that trail which may not be obvious to a new rider, and don't pose a challenge unless they are specifically targeted - like humps and rocks exploited for air time etc. The Stromlo promotional video of Jared Rando riding these 'beginner' trails does a better job of showing the fun that can be had with the right features.

http://www.stromloforestpark.com.au/news/current-news/item/stromlo-is-calling

The previous poster's suggestions about striking a balance between challenging trail features and a ridable track is hard, but one which I think has been achieved in Canberra at Stromlo, both for an easy trail - skyline and luge, and DH - I think the new(ish) part of the B line dh track at Stromlo is another good example - there are some decent jumps, but all are rollable and you always see people coming down it on cross county hard tails. I have taken some beginners down this track and they do enjoy rolling down it (on their bike, not their a$$) They even start to learn to get airborne on this track, due to the design of the jumps.

If these types of tracks is what is meant when people refer to a gravity or enduro track, then it is a concept that could work really well at Bruce with minimal change to track difficulty.

I also agree with the previous posters - if these types of obstacles are not considered, they will end up being built illegally.
Whomever built that large gap jump at the bottom of the DH track at Bruce clearly thought that something was missing from the track

I would be happy to spend some time behind a shovel getting something up and running which caters for this type of riding (will be back in Canberra in August), however if the level of tracks remains the same as it currently is, then I guess it will continue to be Stromlo for me...

All that said, I appreciate the work that has been done to date and the efforts of those to turn the trails into a sustainable solution. If nothing else, I know the trails will be there for a quick cross country ride.

Cheers,

Matt

 

[flagasinappropriate]

It's been years since the public consultation and the plans for the trail network have changed a fair bit since that time also. Given the current closure of a lot of trails (one of my regular loops has had a truckload of branches dumped on it this week)and as you mentioned the plans for directional signage etc IMO an info /discussion session for all interested parties would be beneficial

I totally agree. There has been little consultation in recent times outside the core group of FoBR people. Lets have some more discussion and perhaps broaden it to other trails in the ACT starting with Majura.

 

[jp80]

Great to see some passion here - if only the passion behind keyboards translated to passion behind shovels.

Trailworks on this Sunday, meeting place of that little carpark off belco way? Looks like the FOBR forum hasnt put up any details yet. Have never been but would like to come along this weekend and will probably bring my 3yo too, incase anyone wants to bring someone similar for her to hang out with

I ride there multiple times a week and currently the DH-ish trail is my favourite, will be sad to see it go... happy to hear there is a chance of a replacement, though. I have only been riding there for a few years, but being able to have a lunch break and ride there is one of the main reasons I live in Canberra. A solid thank-you to everyone who has put work in there, both with a shovel and around a consultation table.

 

[Kramer]

Sun 29 June Working Bee

June Working Bee
Date: Sunday 29 June 2014
Time: 8am-12pm
Meeting Location: At the gate near O’Connor caravan park - Kunzea Street, just off Dryandra Street Drive (N8 on the old Bruce Ridge map).
What to Bring: Your favourite trail tools, particularly fire rakes, mattocks, shovels and leaf rakes.
As usual, please bring food, water, weather appropriate clothing, eye protection, gloves and sturdy footwear.
Planned work Areas:
Hopefully, this should be the last big section of trail to be cut in at Bruce! We will be building a new section just above the caravan park to complete the outer loop - parallel to Bruce Pipeline Track (J7-N6).

Hope the warm winter weather holds up - we will go ahead rain, hail or snow. The only show stopper is high wind conditions due to the risk of falling trees and branches.
Any last minute updates will be posted on the FoBR Twitter feed: https://twitter.com/FoBruceRidge

Will be great to catch up with all of the keen Rotorburners and discuss the trails plans.

 

[flagasinappropriate]

June Working Bee

Will be great to catch up with all of the keen Rotorburners and discuss the trails plans.

For the people who can’t make it, would it be possible to have an open discussion here on rotorburn about the planned works and the plans for future trail works at Bruce Ridge?

Also, could we see and discuss the information used in the decision making?

 

[nak]

For the people who can’t make it, would it be possible to have an open discussion here on rotorburn about the planned works and the plans for future trail works at Bruce Ridge?

Also, could we see and discuss the information used in the decision making?

Completey Agree - I'll try and make the trail day on sunday, but all the users of Bruce Ridge need to be involved in discussions for future plans.



Kramer,

Any chance of FOBR setting up a discussion/info session soonish - correct me If I'm wrong but the last one was in 2011 when Anthony Burton was involved.

 

[No Skid Marks]

Going to be perfect soil conditions for digging. Will do my best to be there fixing trails instead of wrecking other wet ones.

 

[Kramer]

Thanks guys for the interest - lots of questions to cover...

Given FoBR has been active and working with PCS for over three years now (since March 2003), it is a little late for people to be coming out of the woodwork now. I understand many people (me included) are upset that trails will be closed, but the final call has been made by PCS.

FoBR has had an AGM at least once every year, plus social rides/drinks to discuss the trails strategy. In addition, the working bees have always included some level of trails strategy discussion, and provided on the ground short term decision making (ie. shovel democracy).

FoBR has been active on Facebook, it's own Forums (link below), and here on Rotorburn - so it's not like the group has been hiding.

The primary sources of information used in the decision making were an ecological assessment conducted by PCS, and an audit of all trails conducted by IMBA - both commissioned by PCS. These assessments were conducted in late 2012 and are the property of PCS. If you are keen to read the hundreds of detailed pages assessing every over hanging branch and orchid clump, I can ask PCS if they are OK to publicly release these.

FoBR provided a response to the above mentioned documents, which was essentially:
1. We need to retain inner-city trails to reduce the risk of unapproved trails being built elsewhere in CNP, perhaps in more ecologically sensitive areas (eg. Black Mountain)
2. We acknowledged the impact on flora and fauna, and agreed some trails would need to close or be realigned to protect rare flora, and provide green space for fauna. (This is especially the case on the southern face of Bruce Ridge).
3. We highlighted the need to balance trail interest and sustainability (ie. we want fun, fast trails even though they may need more maintenance due to erosion - descent trail) Like point 1 - if we don't provide fun trails, they may be built elsewhere, illegally.

In establishing FoBR (which comes under the ACT Parkcare volunteer program), we agreed to operate under the following principles (in priority order):
1. Work with Parks and Conservation Service (PCS) to manage Bruce Ridge to achieve good conservation outcomes
2. To operate within the framework of the PCS Volunteer Policy
3. To engage with and educate the broader community
The proposed trail closures and changes are consistent with the first principle of conservation. The trails strategy to develop an easy outer loop, with more technical inner loop trails (including descent trail) is consistent with providing an experience for the broader community.

The plan for the outer loop and closures has been agreed with PCS, and they are now in the process of undertaking the closures (FoBR declined the back breaking pleasure of digging up old trails). FoBR's primary job from here is to complete the links and maintain the trails.

Where there is still an opportunity, and I encourage you to be involved, is in the tweaking of the inner loops and descent trail.

In regards to Majura - this is not part of FoBRs patch, but is now under the jurisdiction of ACT Parks & Conservation Services (PCS). Last I heard the rebuilding of trails (post-Majura Parkway) was being led by Canberra One Gear. If you have any interest in riding at Majura, then I encourage you to get involved now - not when the new trails plan has been produced and is being actioned!

Sorry for the excessively long, and somewhat ranty post. Hopefully I'll see some of you on Sunday for trail building (details above).

 

[No Skid Marks]

Thanks guys for the interest - lots of questions to cover...

Given FoBR has been active and working with PCS for over three years now (since March 2003), it is a little late for people to be coming out of the woodwork now. I understand many people (me included) are upset that trails will be closed, but the final call has been made by PCS.

FoBR has had an AGM at least once every year, plus social rides/drinks to discuss the trails strategy. In addition, the working bees have always included some level of trails strategy discussion, and provided on the ground short term decision making (ie. shovel democracy).

FoBR has been active on Facebook, it's own Forums (link below), and here on Rotorburn - so it's not like the group has been hiding.

The primary sources of information used in the decision making were an ecological assessment conducted by PCS, and an audit of all trails conducted by IMBA - both commissioned by PCS. These assessments were conducted in late 2012 and are the property of PCS. If you are keen to read the hundreds of detailed pages assessing every over hanging branch and orchid clump, I can ask PCS if they are OK to publicly release these.

FoBR provided a response to the above mentioned documents, which was essentially:
1. We need to retain inner-city trails to reduce the risk of unapproved trails being built elsewhere in CNP, perhaps in more ecologically sensitive areas (eg. Black Mountain)
2. We acknowledged the impact on flora and fauna, and agreed some trails would need to close or be realigned to protect rare flora, and provide green space for fauna. (This is especially the case on the southern face of Bruce Ridge).
3. We highlighted the need to balance trail interest and sustainability (ie. we want fun, fast trails even though they may need more maintenance due to erosion - descent trail) Like point 1 - if we don't provide fun trails, they may be built elsewhere, illegally.

In establishing FoBR (which comes under the ACT Parkcare volunteer program), we agreed to operate under the following principles (in priority order):
1. Work with Parks and Conservation Service (PCS) to manage Bruce Ridge to achieve good conservation outcomes
2. To operate within the framework of the PCS Volunteer Policy
3. To engage with and educate the broader community
The proposed trail closures and changes are consistent with the first principle of conservation. The trails strategy to develop an easy outer loop, with more technical inner loop trails (including descent trail) is consistent with providing an experience for the broader community.

The plan for the outer loop and closures has been agreed with PCS, and they are now in the process of undertaking the closures (FoBR declined the back breaking pleasure of digging up old trails). FoBR's primary job from here is to complete the links and maintain the trails.

Where there is still an opportunity, and I encourage you to be involved, is in the tweaking of the inner loops and descent trail.

In regards to Majura - this is not part of FoBRs patch, but is now under the jurisdiction of ACT Parks & Conservation Services (PCS). Last I heard the rebuilding of trails (post-Majura Parkway) was being led by Canberra One Gear. If you have any interest in riding at Majura, then I encourage you to get involved now - not when the new trails plan has been produced and is being actioned!

Sorry for the excessively long, and somewhat ranty post. Hopefully I'll see some of you on Sunday for trail building (details above).

Good post Kramer.
Hopefully see you sunday.
Canberra One Gear, Oh man, does that mean all the tracks at Majura will be made close to flat for One Gear? I pray not. I'll be trying to get involved there early as mentioned.

 

[flagasinappropriate]

Thanks guys for the interest - lots of questions to cover...

Given FoBR has been active and working with PCS for over three years now (since March 2003), it is a little late for people to be coming out of the woodwork now. I understand many people (me included) are upset that trails will be closed, but the final call has been made by PCS.

FoBR has had an AGM at least once every year, plus social rides/drinks to discuss the trails strategy. In addition, the working bees have always included some level of trails strategy discussion, and provided on the ground short term decision making (ie. shovel democracy).

FoBR has been active on Facebook, it's own Forums (link below), and here on Rotorburn - so it's not like the group has been hiding.

The primary sources of information used in the decision making were an ecological assessment conducted by PCS, and an audit of all trails conducted by IMBA - both commissioned by PCS. These assessments were conducted in late 2012 and are the property of PCS. If you are keen to read the hundreds of detailed pages assessing every over hanging branch and orchid clump, I can ask PCS if they are OK to publicly release these.

FoBR provided a response to the above mentioned documents, which was essentially:
1. We need to retain inner-city trails to reduce the risk of unapproved trails being built elsewhere in CNP, perhaps in more ecologically sensitive areas (eg. Black Mountain)
2. We acknowledged the impact on flora and fauna, and agreed some trails would need to close or be realigned to protect rare flora, and provide green space for fauna. (This is especially the case on the southern face of Bruce Ridge).
3. We highlighted the need to balance trail interest and sustainability (ie. we want fun, fast trails even though they may need more maintenance due to erosion - descent trail) Like point 1 - if we don't provide fun trails, they may be built elsewhere, illegally.

In establishing FoBR (which comes under the ACT Parkcare volunteer program), we agreed to operate under the following principles (in priority order):
1. Work with Parks and Conservation Service (PCS) to manage Bruce Ridge to achieve good conservation outcomes
2. To operate within the framework of the PCS Volunteer Policy
3. To engage with and educate the broader community
The proposed trail closures and changes are consistent with the first principle of conservation. The trails strategy to develop an easy outer loop, with more technical inner loop trails (including descent trail) is consistent with providing an experience for the broader community.

The plan for the outer loop and closures has been agreed with PCS, and they are now in the process of undertaking the closures (FoBR declined the back breaking pleasure of digging up old trails). FoBR's primary job from here is to complete the links and maintain the trails.

Where there is still an opportunity, and I encourage you to be involved, is in the tweaking of the inner loops and descent trail.

In regards to Majura - this is not part of FoBRs patch, but is now under the jurisdiction of ACT Parks & Conservation Services (PCS). Last I heard the rebuilding of trails (post-Majura Parkway) was being led by Canberra One Gear. If you have any interest in riding at Majura, then I encourage you to get involved now - not when the new trails plan has been produced and is being actioned!

Sorry for the excessively long, and somewhat ranty post. Hopefully I'll see some of you on Sunday for trail building (details above).

Thanks for that.

I note that the FoBR forum and Facebook pages exist, however there seems to be little actual discussion about planned works. Instead most of the posts/discussions are advice about the timing and location future works. This unfortunately is not consultation or engagement.

Consultation and engagement takes place where those who are interested are encouraged to make comment in an open forum about what could or should be done, drawing on their broader expertise if any and energy. From there that discussion turns to the shovels where more discussions occur and refinement of the broader plan takes place. But it seems the opportunity to actually discuss this has been passed as the plan for Bruce was decided on long ago.

It was disappointing to see the occasional notice about trail works appear, then fall over or disappear, suggesting that I had missed the opportunity to comment. There was no real need for the recent central trail closures unless there is an ecological reason that I am unaware of. It was not heavily eroded and had reached a reasonable erosion state thanks to the roots and other features that were creating natural erosion limits. These features however could have used some further log and stone assistance to fortify and maintain the trails form and prevent people taking short-cuts.

But my point is and always has been there is a need for pre-works consultation. There is still opportunity to make use of the message boards, have an online discussion here, on Facebook and the FoBR forum to really stimulate engagement. Nearly everyone sees those empty message boards.

A start on this might begin with discussing words for a Bruce Ridge trail etiquette rather than establishing preferred trail directions.

Let’s discuss.

 

[MikeyD]

Majura Pines

Canberra One Gear, Oh man, does that mean all the tracks at Majura will be made close to flat for One Gear? I pray not. I'll be trying to get involved there early as mentioned.

Just to clarify, most single speeders like to ride up hills and often have to pedal around the gravity types pushing their monster machines up the hill. Not to mention that most of Majura Pines is on the side of a hill so it's very unlikely we'll be making it flat.

Seriously though, Canberra One Gear Society's involvement to date has been me trying to get a group together to rebuild the Majura Pines trail network. This has really been limited to a few discussions with Anthony Burton and the establishment of a volunteer register for trail work. Once a formal plan for the Pines has been released and a proper channel with PC&S is established we hope to form a steering group to guide the restoration of the Pines. The Pines will continue as a working forest so there's not much point reinventing the wheel. The loose plan is to re-establish existing trails, where practical, hopefully creating a trunk loop, and then consult on new trails. We're open to ideas and there'll be plenty of opportunity to consult. Given it is a working pine forest with relatively low ecological value we hope to have a bit more freedom with trail design and placement than the FOBR guys have had. if you want to get involved, e-mail your details to majurapinestrails@gmail.com or PM me.

 

[johnny]

Thanks for that.

I note that the FoBR forum and Facebook pages exist, however there seems to be little actual discussion about planned works. Instead most of the posts/discussions are advice about the timing and location future works. This unfortunately is not consultation or engagement.

Consultation and engagement takes place where those who are interested are encouraged to make comment in an open forum about what could or should be done, drawing on their broader expertise if any and energy. From there that discussion turns to the shovels where more discussions occur and refinement of the broader plan takes place. But it seems the opportunity to actually discuss this has been passed as the plan for Bruce was decided on long ago.

It was disappointing to see the occasional notice about trail works appear, then fall over or disappear, suggesting that I had missed the opportunity to comment. There was no real need for the recent central trail closures unless there is an ecological reason that I am unaware of. It was not heavily eroded and had reached a reasonable erosion state thanks to the roots and other features that were creating natural erosion limits. These features however could have used some further log and stone assistance to fortify and maintain the trails form and prevent people taking short-cuts.

But my point is and always has been there is a need for pre-works consultation. There is still opportunity to make use of the message boards, have an online discussion here, on Facebook and the FoBR forum to really stimulate engagement. Nearly everyone sees those empty message boards.

A start on this might begin with discussing words for a Bruce Ridge trail etiquette rather than establishing preferred trail directions.

Let’s discuss.

I'm going to make an assumption that if you want to discuss anything at all you're probably going to have to swing off the end of a shovel a weekend or two before anyone pays you attention.


See y'all on Sunday.

 

[Kramer]

The recent trail closures have not been targeting trails which are specifically unsustainable, they are aimed at reducing the density of trails at Bruce Ridge. More green space is needed between the trails to provide refuge away from bikes and runners for the local fauna (ie. we must reduce the amount of trails at Bruce). Remember, the first principle is conservation (see my post above). [am I starting to sound like a greenie?!?]

As you have noticed, most of the discussion is not online. We have promoted FoBR as much as possible (for people with day jobs and families) - keen people have turned up to meetings, working bees and social events and discussed the trails strategy. Other than emails between FoBR volunteers and PCS, this thread is probably one of the most active online discussions. I encourage anyone to make constructive comments here.

Flags - would be great if you could draft up some content on trail etiquette. I expect it would be a combination of best practices from IMBA, and local approaches for user guidance for Canberra Nature Park, Stromlo Forest Park and Canberra Centenary Trail.

 

[No Skid Marks]

Let’s discuss.

These are just blokes trying to help out, not some government organization were someone is accountable. As mentioned, get on a shovel. Don't get me wrong, I agree with a lot of what you're saying. It'd be great to be able to voice an opinion easily without having to show up here and there. Or prove your worth. The middle needed to be shut to keep some isolated bush for critters and fair enough. I would like to see the character of the middle old school trails replicated and less flowy easy generic trails. It is MTBiking after all.

Just to clarify, most single speeders like to ride up hills and often have to pedal around the gravity types pushing their monster machines up the hill. Not to mention that most of Majura Pines is on the side of a hill so it's very unlikely we'll be making it flat.

Thanks for chiming in, PM sent. Any sort of off shoot of MTBing will create trails to suit themselves, it's a given, but If it was me, all effort would be Gravity orientated tracks, with any ALL MTN style tracks having quick painful but short assents. I don't doubt your dedication and diplomacy.

The recent trail closures have not been targeting trails which are specifically unsustainable, they are aimed at reducing the density of trails at Bruce Ridge. More green space is needed between the trails to provide refuge away from bikes and runners for the local fauna (ie. we must reduce the amount of trails at Bruce). Remember, the first principle is conservation (see my post above). [am I starting to sound like a greenie?!?]

As you have noticed, most of the discussion is not online. We have promoted FoBR as much as possible (for people with day jobs and families) - keen people have turned up to meetings, working bees and social events and discussed the trails strategy. Other than emails between FoBR volunteers and PCS, this thread is probably one of the most active online discussions. I encourage anyone to make constructive comments here.

Flags - would be great if you could draft up some content on trail etiquette. I expect it would be a combination of best practices from IMBA, and local approaches for user guidance for Canberra Nature Park, Stromlo Forest Park and Canberra Centenary Trail.

Good job Kramer, thanks for taking the initiative. I'm a greeny and proud of it by the way, no need for us to consume everything. It's a good stance to take in regards to track work even if you're not one.

 

[flagasinappropriate]

These are just blokes trying to help out, not some government organization were someone is accountable.

As far as I'm aware, a group operating under the parkcare banner has certain obligations to raise community awareness and therefore engagement.

No one has to prove themselves. There are many lurkers following this thread that do not contribute for fear of being shotdown by such calls. Their potentially great input is lost. They also may have their own reasons for not being able to contribute with a shovel and that needs to be respected. So get over it. Everyone should be encouraged to contribute by whatever means practical to them.

Thanks Kramer, greenies are great and I am well aware that Bruce Ridge has a principal conservation purpose with recreation a distant second or third. I have no issue if trails need to be closed if the scientific evidence is there and perhaps discussed openly in the future.

Regarding the Mountain Bike Riders Code, the code found at http://bruceridge.org/mtb/ is a good place to start. But I’ll review some others and put a draft up here soon.

Thanks everyone.