Coroner's report on roadie that died after frame failure

Kerplunk

Likes Bikes and Dirt
When I say easily avoided, I mean that the knowledge and technology exists and has existed for a long time to non destructively inspect these type of parts, it is not new, I was doing it 25 years ago and it was well established then.

Yes this was directed at the industry, they should be putting out parts that have a greater level of quality control. The nature of composites is that it is process driven, in that each part is individually made and can have individual problems, however if the process is not robust the variables become greater. Inspection provides data to validate if the process is robust or not, this should not be up to the rider to find out the hard way. There have been recalls on many forks over the years, which shows that they do get it wrong. They need to learn from getting it wrong.

I don't think the cost is as much a barrier as people suggest, Canyon for example say they CT scan each fork and their bikes are by no means the most expensive in the market.

It comes down to understanding the issues, the bike industry has transitioned from metal bikes to carbon bikes very quickly and appears to have skipped some of the quality process' required. The quality control for a metal tubeset is done at the mill not on each individual frame as it is put together, it is a different mindset.

I am not saying that each rider needs to pay to get their bike inspected by someone with my skillset before they ride, they should not have to, however if you are unsure about things it is clearly prudent to get things checked, especially on a failure critical part like a fork.

Ride safe.
Whodesigns,
No chance you were called to give expert opinion/evidence in the coroners inquest? Would have been interesring if the above opinion was presented to the coroner.
 
This story hits close to home for me except I haven't had my bike fail.

I guess I should pay someone to service my bike and give it a once over but still the problem could lurk beneath
 

bear the bear

Is a real bear
This story hits close to home for me except I haven't had my bike fail.

I guess I should pay someone to service my bike and give it a once over but still the problem could lurk beneath
Problem was in this instance, the bike was serviced by two seperate shops for minor issues.

The only way this may have been detected was a full strip down.

I know personally, the only times that happens is if I'm chasing a creak, new groupset, or about to sell of the fork or frame....
 

schred

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Aren't they saying nothing would have detected the fault ?

I think for $170 my lbs will do a full strip down and service. Maybe I should get it done.
Could be wrong but I think whodesigns was suggesting non-destructive testing be performed systematically by the factory to ensure their QAQC processes are robust and the end product is known good so there's not a question mark by the time you pick it up.

Any inspection by a bike shop is not quite, well not anywhere near the same thing, they simply don't have that capability but nor should they.
 

tomacropod

Likes Dirt
One bike service - $95
One chain - $60
Some brake pads - $40
One routine ct scan - $250

No cracks! See you in 6 months.

I can only imagine the market reaction to this level of caution.

- Joel
 

pink poodle

Our man isn't in the West
Aren't they saying nothing would have detected the fault ?

I think for $170 my lbs will do a full strip down and service. Maybe I should get it done.
In my experience that $170 wouldn't go too far at many an LBS.

One bike service - $95
One chain - $60
Some brake pads - $40
One routine ct scan - $250

No cracks! See you in 6 months.

I can only imagine the market reaction to this level of caution.

- Joel
I can see some shops moving to "specialise" in such a service. It would likely have a good consumer take up.
 

thatsnotme

Likes Dirt
I can see some shops moving to "specialise" in such a service. It would likely have a good consumer take up.
I'd be interested to know whether the ultrasound testing that whodesigns does is something that can be easily learned, even without the extensive background in carbon that someone like him has? And if it is something that a bike mechanic could be taught, who's going to do the teaching? I definitely agree that if this was a service available at more places, there'd be a market for it. Actually getting more places set up to be able to do it properly could be tricky though.
 

whodesigns

Likes Bikes
I'd be interested to know whether the ultrasound testing that whodesigns does is something that can be easily learned, even without the extensive background in carbon that someone like him has? And if it is something that a bike mechanic could be taught, who's going to do the teaching? I definitely agree that if this was a service available at more places, there'd be a market for it. Actually getting more places set up to be able to do it properly could be tricky though.
The ultrasound scan interpretation takes a bit of time to learn, it took about 1 year of on the job training to get certified. It is not a trivial thing as it is easy to mis-interpret signals.
 

wesdadude

Likes Dirt
The ultrasound scan interpretation takes a bit of time to learn, it took about 1 year of on the job training to get certified. It is not a trivial thing as it is easy to mis-interpret signals.
If the interpretation is the hard part and not the scanning it might be feasible to have trained operators locally and outsource the analysis of the images.
 

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
And buggered if I know what the legal ramifications would be if a part which passed inspection was to fail...
 

whodesigns

Likes Bikes
And buggered if I know what the legal ramifications would be if a part which passed inspection was to fail...
No quality control system can 100% guarantee that a complex part will not fail under all loading conditions. However the more data one has, the better informed of the probability of a failure. Thus if I found a flaw in a critical part such as a fork, I would not take the risk of using that part, even though I cannot know exactly if and when it will fail. Remember that failures typically occur when the loads are greater and hence the consequences of the failure are greater. In the case of road forks there have been many recalls on products, the brands would not recall a product unless they considered the risk to be warranted.
 

rowdyflat

chez le médecin
Very bad luck I'm afraid but its impossible to monitor these flaws at a reasonable cost and impractical.
i have a carbon fork from last century will just have to hope even though its done many kms.
Coroners make these sort of recommendations, that is their job but they are often not feasible and ignored in the long term.
 
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