Electric Vehicles etc

ashes_mtb

ashes_mtb

Has preferences
gippyz said:
https://www.theguardian.com/austral...bscription-service-to-boost-australias-uptake

If u use the car a lot, $299 a week which include the car, rego, insurance, charging, and installation of the fast charger at your home is not bad.
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Not sure what sort of vehicle you get for the $299 but based on my own use (~20,000km p.a.) and costs it would be cheaper for me to buy a $50+k car on a loan, and that's not taking into account running cost savings of electric and the fact I'd have an asset with some residual value at the end.

Factor in fuel savings and it's more like a $70k to be comparable

Great option for those that don't want to be locked into purchasing though.
 
leitch

leitch

Feelin' a bit rrranty
Yeah the $299/week is a bit of an ask given it's only a ~5 year pay back but you don't own anything at the end of it. Might be more appealing if they threw in a solar install at home or if the infrastructure/regulatory environment was there to support use of the car as a domestic battery.

That said, could also be a great solution for a sole trader working around town who can just write it straight off as an operating expense.

Either way it's a cool initiative and it's the sort of thing we need more of to get EVs onto the streets.
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
They are checking out all the pigs flying, relating to AGL moving out of the FF business in a timeframe relevant to CC science:

367034


Love a bit of corporate greenwashing.
 
Scotty T

Scotty T

Walks the walk
leitch said:
Yeah the $299/week is a bit of an ask given it's only a ~5 year pay back but you don't own anything at the end of it. Might be more appealing if they threw in a solar install at home or if the infrastructure/regulatory environment was there to support use of the car as a domestic battery.

That said, could also be a great solution for a sole trader working around town who can just write it straight off as an operating expense.

Either way it's a cool initiative and it's the sort of thing we need more of to get EVs onto the streets.
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Given the very small segment of people you've outlined who it would actually work for, I feel like it won't get many EV's on the streets.

Government subsidies on rego, insurance and purchase price would go a lot further, but that would require governments and car companies to care. 99% of TV ads about cars are for ICE models.

It would be a killer scheme if it had smart solar utilising the car battery for home energy included. But that would be AGL shooting themselves in the foot.
 
Haakon

Haakon

has an accommodating arse
Scotty T said:
It would be a killer scheme if it had smart solar utilising the car battery for home energy included. But that would be AGL shooting themselves in the foot.
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Origin have been looking into that full package service. They make money by keeping the RECS.
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
Haakon said:
  • Climate Active certified carbon neutral electricity offsets
The value of the offsets is a seperate argument, but its nevertheless a step in the right direction. its a big ask for AGL to do it all on their own though, so kudos for the effort
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No it's not. Offsets are a thing on paper. They don't exist in the real world.

Step in the right direction - you mean greenwashing is a step in the right direction?

https://www.thefifthestate.com.au/columns/spinifex/climate-active-a-little-more-action-please/

Drink the coolaid...
 
Haakon

Haakon

has an accommodating arse
P

Petero

Likes Dirt
Until and unless the power in this country is dominated by renewable sources, EV is kinda a waste of time.

Add to that you need batteries that are created from mined and processed materials so you've got even more energy use going into building the car and it's parts than a conventional vehicle.

Steps in the right direction, sure, but this space needs work.

FCEV is marginally better...
 
Haakon

Haakon

has an accommodating arse
Petero said:
Until and unless the power in this country is dominated by renewable sources, EV is kinda a waste of time.

Add to that you need batteries that are created from mined and processed materials so you've got even more energy use going into building the car and it's parts than a conventional vehicle.

Steps in the right direction, sure, but this space needs work.

FCEV is marginally better...
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Someone else want to take this one? Some pretty tired misconceptions there...
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
Haakon said:
Try and be a little more constructive... I don’t like offsets either from a purists point of view, but they have their place in the broader scheme of things.
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Wrong. Read the link I provided. They are an example of bullshit marketing.

Emission reduction is the only answer. Reduce CO2 emissions into the atmosphere at a rate commensurate with the science.

Offsets don't do this.
 
P

Petero

Likes Dirt
"Australia's largest polluter develops scheme to make more money and future proof carbon emitting assets through EV subscriptions.."

Don't get me wrong, it offsets emissions, but the only winner in this scenario is still AGL.
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
Show me an EV solution that results in this:

367035


The point of this AGL discussion seems to be that what they are doing (providing a EV ownership scheme) will achieve the reduction requirements shown above.

Cynical old me just says this program exists so AGL do not have to meet the aggressive reduction requirements shown above.

Bullshit marketing.

BTW - individual EV ownership results in BAU CO2 emissions, by & large (manufacturing emissions == use emissions). If we reduced the number of cars on the road and made them EVs, we'd be heading in the right direction.

But replacing every ICE with EV doesn't really do diddly.
 
leitch

leitch

Feelin' a bit rrranty
@hifiandmtb I don't think anyone is saying that AGL rolling out subscription EVs is the answer to meeting emissions pathways, or even that EVs themselves are the answer. To adopt that premise as the basis for a counter argument is really reductive.

The potential benefits of a scheme like this are obviously tiny at best but to wholly write it off as a cynical marketing scheme with no value I think misses the mark. Everybody knows in principle that most climate friendly car you can buy is the one you already own, but the reality is that doesn't make people stop buying cars. I completely agree with what I think is a point you've made here before - that governments at all levels in Australia have been weak as piss and have done everything they can to shift responsibility for emissions reduction to individuals in a way that is a complete embarrassment - but I don't think that means that individual choice shouldn't still be a target, and if there is a subset of the community for whom the transition to EV is made easier by this, then great.

Similarly, we all know that the efficacy of EVs as an emissions reduction mechanism is dependent on the energy generation mix, but renewables transition is going to take a long time. People are going to keep buying new cars in the meantime whether we like it or not - surely we can agree that it's better those cars are EVs than ICEs, given their operating emissions will decrease over time as the mix improves rather than increase over time like ICE.
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
You have your thoughts, I have mine.

We are either trying to solve CC or we are not.

By & large, EVs just enable the rich to keep on emitting. Until manufacturing emissions for EVs is driven down, don't build the bloody things en mass!
 
Tubbsy

Tubbsy

Packin' a small bird
Staff member
The way to get this system working better would be if you didn't have to rent in one month blocks at a minimum.

If they bridged the gap with the goGet-style on-demand model where you could rent for a week here and there, two to three car households might be convinced to scale down to only owning one car.
 
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