Internal Geared Hubs

mtb101

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Warning long post!

A bit of background:
Well after commuting on the single speeder 29 rigid for 12 months reckon it's time to further enhance the experience. Some would say it's a backward step or pedal.:)

My commute is around 9k in and 20k home via single track - mostly flattish some climbs, nothing I can't muscle up on.

Believe me since commuting single speed I have legs of steel, I can also spin at over 100 cadence quite comfortably. Running a 33:18 means I spin out at about 28kph, climbing wise can just get up 3-5% climbs before I reckon somethings going to break i.e. chain or me.

So as my commute is also a bit of a training session, there are lots of sneaky climbs I can do to get my vertical ascent up to around 350-400 metres for ride home - this is a killer mid week workout.

But ..... we all know how we like to conquer the really gnarly climbs (can do them all on 29 HT 27 speed) but of course the old rigid just aren't too good on the finer points of climbing - can't exactly weave around a rut if you know what I mean. Of course the 29er HT comes out for big rides, but as a commuter, too much bike and don't need the wear and tear for the ks I am doing.

Enter the Internal Hub:
So there's Shimano, Rohloff, SRAM, Sturmey Archer, NuVinci. Well only need a 3 speed I reckon: 33:22, 18, 16, but current units aren't really robust enough or recommended for off road. There's considerations of weight (1kg - 2kg), weather the unit can withstand off-road abuse, i.e. shifting loads, mud, ratios - even vibration. Most units are commuter type road.

After some research and considerations of where I can get one online: Shimano make 2 Hubs Alfine 8 & 11 that have a disc brake provision. Alfine 11 is their robust off-roader (around $500+), the 8 ($230) should cut is as well I'm hoping. So went for the 8 speed Alfine Internal Geared Hub.

Reckon with a internal hub the 29er Rigid going to be a weapon on the commute. So will post some pics once I get it all set up if anyone's interested.

 

harmonix1234

Eats Squid
Have you thought about using a three speed shifter that you'd normally have on the triple ring, rigging it up to a RD and making a three speed cassette with spacers?

Sounds like a lot of faffing around but I am debating an internal hub for the same reasons and thinking about making mine a three speed by having one up front and three on the back (rather than a hub so I can save some $).
I'm currently living on the big ring and only shifting up or down a gear or two on the back when I hit a climb. And if you have an old shifter, cassette and spacers you could do it pretty simple and cheap.

If you do go for the geared hub let us know how it goes as I'm pretty keen/curious myself.
 

tomacropod

Likes Dirt
An interesting post. I've been riding my 29er with Alfine 11 a bit lately, and just set up a Salsa 29er with a Rohloff hub.

I think you've picked the right hub with the Alfine 8. The 11 speed is lighter than the 8 and uses a "normal" shifter arrangement (high normal), but the roller clutch design, to me, feels a little soft. The 8 speed hub used a normal pawl clutch design and has a much stiffer engagement - I think making it better for off-road.

Rohloff is efficient, quiet, stiff, tough and easy to get in and out of a bike - but many times the cost. In my opinion the best on every level.

Let us know how the 8 speed goes! Don't forget to check your axle nuts regularly - the rotating axle can tend to loosen them slightly.

- Joel
 
An interesting post. I've been riding my 29er with Alfine 11 a bit lately, and just set up a Salsa 29er with a Rohloff hub.

I think you've picked the right hub with the Alfine 8. The 11 speed is lighter than the 8 and uses a "normal" shifter arrangement (high normal), but the roller clutch design, to me, feels a little soft. The 8 speed hub used a normal pawl clutch design and has a much stiffer engagement - I think making it better for off-road.

Rohloff is efficient, quiet, stiff, tough and easy to get in and out of a bike - but many times the cost. In my opinion the best on every level.

Let us know how the 8 speed goes! Don't forget to check your axle nuts regularly - the rotating axle can tend to loosen them slightly.

- Joel
I agree completely, we have a 11 Speed alfine on our demo Swift right now and I have had it on the Milkmoney too. I think its a bit soft, it wont change under load (I know Im not supposed to but in the real world it happens). I prefer both the swift and the MM as single speeds, they just work better like that.
I might put the 11 on a Peregrine, I think it would suit that better.

Previously had an 8 speed on another 29er and I reckon it was actually better in how it worked than the 11 is.

Anyone wants to give the 11 a try on a swift just yell out.
 

thelankyman

Likes Dirt
I have installed a 8 speed Afline on my 29er rigid. I love riding SS but SS to work and crits was impossible. I would be more shagged from the commute home from crits than the actual race.

I kinda like it. I basically ride it as a SS rarely changing gears except on the hilly stuff. The only downside is changing under tension (it spat me over the handle bars one time, not fun on a uphill pinch) and the weight. Also mu Karate Monkey kinda requires full length housing which add alot of friction on a 22 inch bike

If you lived somewhere muddy I reckon they would be the bees knees, but really if is better just to get a 1x9 setup.

I got mine as an experiment as it was cheap and ultimately wanted a IGH crosser for all weather commuting.

ps it is fun trying to track stand on the bike as it takes a quarter turn to engage when you begin pedalling,
 

al_

Likes Dirt
I had a cargo bike for testing with an alfine 8. It had a few quirks, but I quite liked it - in that context at least.

The ability to change gears while coasting/stationary probably isn't as valuable on a mtb, and I would miss the freewheel noise. If you have a SS frame without a derailleur mount it makes perfect sense though, and the lack of maintenance required would be nice on a commuter.

I think the inability to shift under any load would concern me - have you tested one out?
 

No Skid Marks

Blue Mountain Bikes Brooklyn/Lahar/Kowa/PO1NT Raci
Do the 8 and 11 Alfine share the same diameter/strength axles?
I'd like to use one as I have hte 8 inboard on my DH bike.
I'm thinking of getting a cromo hardtail made with an Alfine inboard above BB to centralize weight, and protect hub. Will mean 83mm BB though.
Aparently the 8s run more eficiently with oil as well as grease. Check hubstripping for details. Reducces service interval time as well as friction though.
 

mtb101

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Do the 8 and 11 Alfine share the same diameter/strength axles?
I'd like to use one as I have hte 8 inboard on my DH bike.
I'm thinking of getting a cromo hardtail made with an Alfine inboard above BB to centralize weight, and protect hub. Will mean 83mm BB though.
Aparently the 8s run more eficiently with oil as well as grease. Check hubstripping for details. Reducces service interval time as well as friction though.
pretty sure they're are the same 135mm. One thing I like about the single speed downhill is that it's silent, hub would be the same - so you would be able to sneak up on your mates.
 

mtb101

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Have you thought about using a three speed shifter that you'd normally have on the triple ring, rigging it up to a RD and making a three speed cassette with spacers?

Sounds like a lot of faffing around but I am debating an internal hub for the same reasons and thinking about making mine a three speed by having one up front and three on the back (rather than a hub so I can save some $).
I'm currently living on the big ring and only shifting up or down a gear or two on the back when I hit a climb. And if you have an old shifter, cassette and spacers you could do it pretty simple and cheap.

If you do go for the geared hub let us know how it goes as I'm pretty keen/curious myself.
Bike is a purpose built single speed, so the whole Derailleur thing is kind of against the spirit of the bike. Don't think I have mounting provision anyway. Thing I like about the single speed is the smoothness and silent drive train. The rear wheel will probably owe me $350 finished (DT Swiss Rim 29) but as a commuter/training bike I should be able to crack some pretty good climbs with gusto. I have a training loop I do, problem is my climbing cadence is way too slow so it's a bit like toughing out a climb when you miss hitting a low gear at base.

Gear 5 on the alfine is 1:1 so at the moment I will run 33 up front and 20 on rear so I will have 4 climb gears and 3 top end gears. Not sure yet whether 33 will be suitable the Cannondale Bad Boy runs 38:20 so not sure yet.
 
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harmonix1234

Eats Squid
Bike is a purpose built single speed, so the whole Derailleur thing is kind of against the spirit of the bike. Don't think I have mounting provision anyway. Thing I like about the single speed is the smoothness and silent drive train. The rear wheel will probably owe me $350 finished (DT Swiss Rim 29) but as a commuter/training bike I should be able to crack some pretty good climbs with gusto. I have a training loop I do, problem is my climbing cadence is way too slow so it's a bit like toughing out a climb when you miss hitting a low gear at base.

Gear 5 on the alfine is 1:1 so at the moment I will run 33 up front and 20 on rear so I will have 4 climb gears and 3 top end gears. Not sure yet whether 33 will be suitable the Cannondale Bad Boy runs 38:20 so not sure yet.
Fair enough.
I read the other day about a girl who is riding/touring some crazy distance and she has a rohloff with a gates carbon drive combo.
Looks nice, quiet, reliable, low maintenance, strong and unique.
Probably super expensive but being a tech head I'm fascinated with stuff like this.
Gotta have breakable chainstays or seatstays though.

 

mtb101

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I also read about a guy touring in Africa with rohloff that broke. Had to wait 2 weeks for parts, makes you realize that the good old Derailleur is still the most robust and simple setup.
 

g-fish

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I'd like to see more bikes with alfine/rohloff hub and a hamershimdt crank set-up. There'd be gearing overlap, but the prospect of having a clean looking, straight chainline, fuss free drivetrain with up to 28 gears is very enticing.
 
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