BM Epic
Eats Squid
I run visa-versa to you grant, but i know the battery sits atop the helmet without any trouble whatever, go the pigmy, 1000 lumens of goodness, also it comes with extension cord to go in a jersey pocket or pack!
Lights?
- Thread starter Mays86
- Start date
crank1979
Likes Bikes and Dirt
I've tried it the other way around as well but it doesn't really make a big difference. I can't remember what beam spread i asked for but i think i asked for the Pygmy Max to be the same as the Lumen8r Quad. I figured having less weight on my head would be good so i just run it with the Pgymy Max on top. Either way they are top lights and i've been very happy with them so far. Buying Australian, greats CS, not paying for a fancy box or colours and 1000 lumens; what's not to like!
Thanks. I was more intersted in the pygmey but only if the battery would comfortably go on the helmet without being too heavy. I might ring the guy and see if the upgrade to 1300 lumens is just a rumour or not.
Edit: BMEpic what battery do you run? I rang the guy and he said only the 11.1v battery (150g) is the only battery you'd want to run on your head, the others combined with the light are too heavy.
Also he said it's possible to get a 1300 lumen setup now but the only issue is overheating ie if you are going uphill slowly or stopping to chat.
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thecat
NSWMTB, Central Tableland MBC
As Wazza says he's been running the test model for 12 months. Quiet a few of our guys, including myself, are now running them too and after the demos kerry gave on weekend I'd expect a few more people will be as well
As a bonus they are fully programmable so you can set them as you need them. Want more battery life for a big enduro where you just need bright and fricken bright without having to cycle through 5 different brightness setting, you can or if you want fricken bright and super fricken awesomely bright but don't need 15hr of battery life you can do that too without changing lights or batterys
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BM Epic
Eats Squid
I run the pygmy 720 lumen with the 3 and a half hour battery, it's light enough for the helmet, but i would run it in a pocket or pack to keep the weight down, i am not sure what weight the 1000 lumen pigmy max is though, it may be a little heavier, just check the website, he has all the weights, or ring daniel himself, he is a legend!
Mr Pants
skanky media ho
K-Lite's on the brightest setting will actually vaporize trees out of your path
[1][1] may not be entirely true....
I thought I'd post a link to my thread I just started..http://www.rotorburn.com/forums/showthread.php?204314-New-bike-light-looks-AWESOME!! those K-lite's look OK, but IMO the Lumen Liberator will blow it away..the K-lite is rated at 1100lm (on paper, as the site says) but in reality it will be a fair bit less due to losses in the circuits, optics etc..
The Lumen Liberator can theoretically produce over 2000lm, but in reality this will probably be closer to 1500lm OUT THE FRONT!
I've been doing a fair bit of study on LEDs, their circuitry and output lately and I can safely say that almost all the lights on the market (MTB specific, and some high end flashlights) don't use OTF (out the front) lumens to rate their lights.
What this means is that alot of manufacturers are rating their lights based upon maximum recommended drive current and maximum efficiency of the circuitry, basically what the LED could possibly produce in a perfectly regulated loss-less system.
BTW, not crapping on Ay-Up but their lights are very primitive in design and aren't worth near the money they're asking for them IMHO.
As a package deal for the non-tech-savvy or for those who aren't in the know they're seemingly good value, and hey I guess that's their market, not many MTB riders have a deep understanding of electronics and some just want to avoid that altogether.
Their website also has clearly misleading information which puts me off.
At one point it states the use of "..the brightest LED’s on the planet we use CREE XRE LED’s" and on another page they state they offer a variety of beam options such as narrow, intermediate and medium beam angles when relating the their type of LED emitter used. This is not possible, and it should be noted that it would be down to the optics to determine beam angle if using the same emitters (cannot see anywhere that they use more than one type of emitter).
Then there is their claim of the brightest LED's on the planet, which is also downright wrong. You can get a Luminus SST-50 or SST-90 which will put out well over 600lm (depending on optics and drive current, the SST-90 will obliterate both the XR-E and the SST-50 if driven hard enough - think 2000+ lumens).
So not to condemn them, I'd say they are well put together and offer the average person the ability to purchase one package and get good use out of it.
My friend has some and they are more than adequate for most people in terms of output and usable light, however if you know your stuff then you'll be turned off by the marketing hype and misleading information on their website.
IMO get a real good torch that will fit a handlebar mount (you can get a BRIGHT torch for under $200 and many torches will fit a conventional handlebar mount). I have a light which uses a single AA battery - not the most powerful by far - but it will absolutely destroy a 6D (FUCKING HUGE AND HEAVY) MAGLITE and weighs less than ONE OF THE D SIZE BATTERIES!!! That's just an indication of what lights are available..for the same cost as a set of Ay-Ups you could have a light on your bars which is about as long as your stem and a smaller light on your helmet which is about as big as your index finger.
Now factor in some spare rechargeable batteries which weigh less and provide similar run times to a pack and you can have brighter light for longer as you can carry these spare cells a lot easier than a few spare packs. And to top if all off after you're finished you can actually use that beast of a light off the bike and not feel like a weirdo using some strange looking bike light with very poor thermal transfer when not in motion (cooled by wind).
The Lumen Liberator can theoretically produce over 2000lm, but in reality this will probably be closer to 1500lm OUT THE FRONT!
I've been doing a fair bit of study on LEDs, their circuitry and output lately and I can safely say that almost all the lights on the market (MTB specific, and some high end flashlights) don't use OTF (out the front) lumens to rate their lights.
What this means is that alot of manufacturers are rating their lights based upon maximum recommended drive current and maximum efficiency of the circuitry, basically what the LED could possibly produce in a perfectly regulated loss-less system.
BTW, not crapping on Ay-Up but their lights are very primitive in design and aren't worth near the money they're asking for them IMHO.
As a package deal for the non-tech-savvy or for those who aren't in the know they're seemingly good value, and hey I guess that's their market, not many MTB riders have a deep understanding of electronics and some just want to avoid that altogether.
Their website also has clearly misleading information which puts me off.
At one point it states the use of "..the brightest LED’s on the planet we use CREE XRE LED’s" and on another page they state they offer a variety of beam options such as narrow, intermediate and medium beam angles when relating the their type of LED emitter used. This is not possible, and it should be noted that it would be down to the optics to determine beam angle if using the same emitters (cannot see anywhere that they use more than one type of emitter).
Then there is their claim of the brightest LED's on the planet, which is also downright wrong. You can get a Luminus SST-50 or SST-90 which will put out well over 600lm (depending on optics and drive current, the SST-90 will obliterate both the XR-E and the SST-50 if driven hard enough - think 2000+ lumens).
So not to condemn them, I'd say they are well put together and offer the average person the ability to purchase one package and get good use out of it.
My friend has some and they are more than adequate for most people in terms of output and usable light, however if you know your stuff then you'll be turned off by the marketing hype and misleading information on their website.
IMO get a real good torch that will fit a handlebar mount (you can get a BRIGHT torch for under $200 and many torches will fit a conventional handlebar mount). I have a light which uses a single AA battery - not the most powerful by far - but it will absolutely destroy a 6D (FUCKING HUGE AND HEAVY) MAGLITE and weighs less than ONE OF THE D SIZE BATTERIES!!! That's just an indication of what lights are available..for the same cost as a set of Ay-Ups you could have a light on your bars which is about as long as your stem and a smaller light on your helmet which is about as big as your index finger.
Now factor in some spare rechargeable batteries which weigh less and provide similar run times to a pack and you can have brighter light for longer as you can carry these spare cells a lot easier than a few spare packs. And to top if all off after you're finished you can actually use that beast of a light off the bike and not feel like a weirdo using some strange looking bike light with very poor thermal transfer when not in motion (cooled by wind).
pi11wizard
Likes Dirt
+2
I know Kerry personally and have spent quite a bit of time talking lights with him and he lives and breathes this stuff. There has been so much planning, design and experience in his latest light that it borders on ridiculous.
Hi Ranga,
Thanks for your time to help educate the needy masses...
the Liberator is a great DIY light, & is made by a good friend of mine, troutie...he has been making lights, almost as long as me...as part of the DIY community we help each other, & others, for the good of the DIY light building & to develop better products...Trout & I have a understanding...he makes the big stuff, I make the small stuff... mostly it works well...
the liberator, is the same guts as mine (k-lite). but runs 6 LEDs, rather then 3, that is in mine. So for sure it would be brighter & use more power to do so. & be heaver & bigger...but thats the trade off for more light... so if you are into DH stuff... 6 LEDs are better than 3...
Really we both use the same stuff, same as HID tec as well...cree XPG or XPE... what you wrap it in makes little difference to the final output...how much light is really the question you need to ask yourself...
The numbers are for people to get a handle on now bright something is...& no one states OTF numbers...if I did it would confuse people more & un-less others do it, its not really a reference for them to use...so I say to people 'on paper' its whatever...I am trying to make it easy, rather than get all techy by quoting OTF loss % for each bit that gets in the way of the light coming out, but happy to give them to people that are interested. Truth is, qouting LM's ONLY, is a waste of time, LUX is what we need as well...LM= how much light, where as LUX, will tell you how much 'punch' you will get out of it. You can have 1000lm with a 80deg beam & 100lm with a 10deg optic & the 100lm will punch further down the road... even the cree bins R2,R3 R5 ect, have quite a bit of variance, so really unless you do full blown tests on every LED you make, you will never really know how much light you have... so lets make it simple for people to understand, as really, we just wana ride bikes...
What makes a good light is not the LED, but the driver electronics, as a LED does not really fail... its the driver that can have issues...cheap Chinese LED drivers are the cause of 99% of all light failures, other than poor cabling or QC issues with batteys.
Trout & I both use the same guy for our driver boards, these boards have interfaces that are made for MTBers by MTBers, This driver can be setup however you like...its the bee's nees's of LED drivers, their aint no better...& that's a fact!
For me its all about, less is more...over 1000lm its daylight anyway...if you have 2 (helmet & bar), then for 24hr racing, you do not need more light than that...K-lite offers a very small, light weight & reliable system, that, for the money, is lighter, brighter & more configurable, that any store bought light, hands down...unless you build yourself, you won't get 'on paper' over 1000lm for the price you can get a k-lite for...unless you want cheap chinese LED drivers.. then buy a MS light... good luck.
keep the rubber side down...
Ktronik
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BM Epic
Eats Squid
Even though i bought Hid Tech stuff, i never even heard of you guys, although daniel(hid) explained to me what you were saying,it is interesting what you say, after lots of research i came to the conclusion that Hid Tech was best suited for me, now that i know who you guys are, my daughter is after another light, i will have to consider you guys, will talk to Flynny, he also recommends you guys, and that is good enough for me!Hi Ranga,
Thanks for your time to help educate the needy masses...
the Liberator is a great DIY light, & is made by a good friend of mine, troutie...he has been making lights, almost as long as me...as part of the DIY community we help each other, & others, for the good of the DIY light building & to develop better products...Trout & I have a understanding...he makes the big stuff, I make the small stuff... mostly it works well...
the liberator, is the same guts as mine (k-lite). but runs 6 LEDs, rather then 3, that is in mine. So for sure it would be brighter & use more power to do so. & be heaver & bigger...but thats the trade off for more light... so if you are into DH stuff... 6 LEDs are better than 3...
Really we both use the same stuff, same as HID tec as well...cree XPG or XPE... what you wrap it in makes little difference to the final output...how much light is really the question you need to ask yourself...
The numbers are for people to get a handle on now bright something is...& no one states OTF numbers...if I did it would confuse people more & un-less others do it, its not really a reference for them to use...so I say to people 'on paper' its whatever...I am trying to make it easy, rather than get all techy by quoting OTF loss % for each bit that gets in the way of the light coming out, but happy to give them to people that are interested. Truth is, qouting LM's ONLY, is a waste of time, LUX is what we need as well...LM= how much light, where as LUX, will tell you how much 'punch' you will get out of it. You can have 1000lm with a 80deg beam & 100lm with a 10deg optic & the 100lm will punch further down the road... even the cree bins R2,R3 R5 ect, have quite a bit of variance, so really unless you do full blown tests on every LED you make, you will never really know how much light you have... so lets make it simple for people to understand, as really, we just wana ride bikes...
What makes a good light is not the LED, but the driver electronics, as a LED does not really fail... its the driver that can have issues...cheap Chinese LED drivers are the cause of 99% of all light failures, other than poor cabling or QC issues with batteys.
Trout & I both use the same guy for our driver boards, these boards have interfaces that are made for MTBers by MTBers, This driver can be setup however you like...its the bee's nees's of LED drivers, their aint no better...& that's a fact!
For me its all about, less is more...over 1000lm its daylight anyway...if you have 2 (helmet & bar), then for 24hr racing, you do not need more light than that...K-lite offers a very small, light weight & reliable system, that, for the money, is lighter, brighter & more configurable, that any store bought light, hands down...unless you build yourself, you won't get 'on paper' over 1000lm for the price you can get a k-lite for...unless you want cheap chinese LED drivers.. then buy a MS light... good luck.
keep the rubber side down...
Ktronik
thecat
NSWMTB, Central Tableland MBC
Will have to hook up for a mts or Lithgow ride and you can give the demo light a crack. (H-walls tuesday week?)
BM Epic
Eats Squid
Get it up on the turgid hole and i'm there mate, looking forward to seeing these babies in the flesh!
crank1979
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Brilliant HIDTechnologies service!
Last Monday my HIDTech Lumen8r Quad stopped working. I didn't know if it was the battery, light unit or charger so i sent them all off on Wednesday via regular parcel post. I got it back today. That was pretty quick i thought. I rang Daniel to say thanks and ask about the new connectors that had been fitted to all 3 pieces. I missed the recall on the light because the connectors weren't great because i hadn't updated my email address, fair enough.
So now the light is back and working as awesome as it did before but with better connectors.
Last Monday my HIDTech Lumen8r Quad stopped working. I didn't know if it was the battery, light unit or charger so i sent them all off on Wednesday via regular parcel post. I got it back today. That was pretty quick i thought. I rang Daniel to say thanks and ask about the new connectors that had been fitted to all 3 pieces. I missed the recall on the light because the connectors weren't great because i hadn't updated my email address, fair enough.
So now the light is back and working as awesome as it did before but with better connectors.