Needle in the eye (needle bearing shock eyelet bushings)

[Nambra]

Not sure if this should be in @Scotty T's thread or bargain buys...

Came across this YT'er who did a bit of a spiel on the RWC needle bearings, and has a discount code for 25% off - doesn't say how long for though. If you're curious on these bearings, could be a good time to pick one up.

Code is in video description.

 

[Litenbror]

Not sure if this should be in @Scotty T's thread or bargain buys...

Came across this YT'er who did a bit of a spiel on the RWC needle bearings, and has a discount code for 25% off - doesn't say how long for though. If you're curious on these bearings, could be a good time to pick one up.

Code is in video description.

Yep just checked and the code works. Does anyone know how these compare to the ones from DIY mtd? I know it was talked about earlier but I don't think anyone had a comparison (happy to be proved wrong because I really didn't look very hard)

 

[Nambra]

Suggest you flick back to the first 5 or so posts of this thread, might help answer your question.

I believe the DIY ones are an Enduro brand roller bearing, and people have complained of excessive play in Enduro on other forums. RWC kits include several inner sleeves to give you the best fit without any play.

 

[beeb]

I've bought two pairs of the RWC bearings for my own bikes, and installed a third pair on a mates frame and the multiple different tolerance shafts are definitely worth having IMO. I was actually quite surprised how much fit and tolerance variation there would have been without them... They're stupidly expensive, but they should at least have good longevity with well matched shaft fitment.

 

[Flow-Rider]

I've bought two pairs of the RWC bearings for my own bikes, and installed a third pair on a mates frame and the multiple different tolerance shafts are definitely worth having IMO. I was actually quite surprised how much fit and tolerance variation there would have been without them... They're stupidly expensive, but they should at least have good longevity with well matched shaft fitment.

I wonder if the cheaper ones are really tight because they'll knock if they're loose.

 

[Scotty T]

I wonder if the cheaper ones are really tight because they'll knock if they're loose.

Guessing they're much better than the standard bushings.

 

[Sethius]

Have used DIY ones over last few years with great success. Last generation Scott's massively benefited from them.

 

[Mr Crudley]

I put the RWC ones in recently. I do like that they send you the size you asked along with a few smaller and bigger so you get a good match.

Needle bearings are a great and easy upgrade. Worth the effort and I sure can notice it over bushings.

 

[Flow-Rider]

Guessing they're much better than the standard bushings.

If they're too tight it will defeat the purpose of installing them and if they're too loose you'll get a dreaded annoying shock knock, well that's what sprung to my mind but I've only ever used the RWC ones with the 3 different bushes.

 

[EsPeGe]

So I'm thinking about installing needle bearings on my Wreckoning and I'm interested in what you guys think in regards long term. I've read a good article that points out that needle bearings aren't actually a good fit for this application for a couple of reasons. Firstly they are open rather than sealed and therefore can be very susceptible to grit. Also the bearings and or bushes don't actually move all that much and can "notch" the race. I've also read they can lead to suspension clunk when they loosen up a bit. So what do you guys think? Am I better getting some low friction bushings from Push to fit my ElevenSix shock or give the needles a crack. I must admit for the low cost I'm tempted to just have a crack but if I can save some time then it makes sense to ask.

Cheers Scott.

 

[Nambra]

Zero problems with my RWC needle bearing. They have good seals both sides so grit isn’t really an issue. The different size sleeves that come with the RWC ones ensure you can get a nice firm fit with no clunking and, as far as notching goes, surely they can’t be that different to a standard cartridge bearing in a suspension pivot or on newer shock mounts.

 

[Flow-Rider]

Firstly they are open rather than sealed and therefore can be very susceptible to grit.

It's just like anything else, buy cheap and that's what you get, the good quality brands are very sealed.

Also the bearings and or bushes don't actually move all that much and can "notch" the race.

Probably no different to pivot bearings, but they're not difficult to turn or repack and easily last the service period of most shocks.

I've also read they can lead to suspension clunk when they loosen up a bit.

The more expense branded bearings have 3 different ground sleeves to suit the crush and clearance with the roller bearing.

So what do you guys think? Am I better getting some low friction bushings from Push to fit my ElevenSix shock or give the needles a crack. I must admit for the low cost I'm tempted to just have a crack but if I can save some time then it makes sense to ask.

Something you need to evaluate yourself, if you don't have a lot of bush rotation from your specific linkages maybe a waste of time.

 

[Nambra]

Something you need to evaluate yourself, if you don't have a lot of bush rotation from your specific linkages maybe a waste of time.

It looks like the Wreckoning’s Delta link rotates through about 50-60 degrees relative to the shock if you look at this animation: https://www.evil-bikes.com/pages/tech, so possibly a good contender for a roller bearing in the upper shock mount.

 

[Mr Crudley]

So I'm thinking about installing needle bearings on my Wreckoning and I'm interested in what you guys think in regards long term. I've read a good article that points out that needle bearings aren't actually a good fit for this application for a couple of reasons. Firstly they are open rather than sealed and therefore can be very susceptible to grit. Also the bearings and or bushes don't actually move all that much and can "notch" the race. I've also read they can lead to suspension clunk when they loosen up a bit. So what do you guys think? Am I better getting some low friction bushings from Push to fit my ElevenSix shock or give the needles a crack. I must admit for the low cost I'm tempted to just have a crack but if I can save some time then it makes sense to ask.

Cheers Scott.

I put some RWC needels bearings on the TRc. Thye worked fine but another option is the heavy duty shock bushing from TFtuned. There are bugger all moving parts and after a hell of long time, I look like I will need to finally replace the rubber sealing ring. Other than that, I have no play and still moves smoothly. They make them in a quite a few shapes and sizes.

https://www.tftuned.com/tech-help/71-mount-kits-and-bushings-for-rear-shocks

 

[Isaakk]

I have a RWC needle bearing in the Marino's rear/seatstay link, developed play almost right away and has a noticeable give if you lift the seat slightly. Swapping the oversized sleeve in took up some slack again but developed play after only another couple rides.

I think it's simply due to how flexy the rear is with the single pivot steel frame, other than the above issue there was a noticeable improvement in smoothness - practically zero stiction or resistance with a DVO Topaz.

If anyone has any recommendations on getting it to play nice, i'm all ears

 

[link1896]

I have a RWC needle bearing in the Marino's rear/seatstay link, developed play almost right away and has a noticeable give if you lift the seat slightly. Swapping the oversized sleeve in took up some slack again but developed play after only another couple rides.

I think it's simply due to how flexy the rear is with the single pivot steel frame, other than the above issue there was a noticeable improvement in smoothness - practically zero stiction or resistance with a DVO Topaz.

If anyone has any recommendations on getting it to play nice, i'm all ears

The issue lies around the size of the eyelet in the shock. It’s reamed at the factory, and there is commonly a lot a variability.

Ideally have your favourite service provider provide a custom solution, with a custom ground axle to get the sizing just right. I know Dougal at Shockcraft in NZ does this. He needs the shock and all mounting hardware.

 

[Scotty T]

Zero problems with my RWC needle bearing. They have good seals both sides so grit isn’t really an issue. The different size sleeves that come with the RWC ones ensure you can get a nice firm fit with no clunking and, as far as notching goes, surely they can’t be that different to a standard cartridge bearing in a suspension pivot or on newer shock mounts.

Same here.

 

[Scotty T]

Oh and almost 2000km on mine now, completely rock solid like the day I installed it.

 

[EsPeGe]

It's just like anything else, buy cheap and that's what you get, the good quality brands are very sealed.



Probably no different to pivot bearings, but they're not difficult to turn or repack and easily last the service period of most shocks.

The more expense branded bearings have 3 different ground sleeves to suit the crush and clearance with the roller bearing.


Something you need to evaluate yourself, if you don't have a lot of bush rotation from your specific linkages maybe a waste of time.

Thanks for the detailed reply mate. All good points and as per Nambra's reply the wrecker does move a fair bit so I think I'll have a crack.

 

[EsPeGe]

It looks like the Wreckoning’s Delta link rotates through about 50-60 degrees relative to the shock if you look at this animation: https://www.evil-bikes.com/pages/tech, so possibly a good contender for a roller bearing in the upper shock mount.

Yeah I think it could be thanks mate. I didn't know it moved quite so far.