Plastic bags, climate change, renewable energy,

Flow-Rider

Wheel size expert
Hygienic reasons? How is carrying a bucket full of rubbish to a wheelie bin less hygienic than moving the same waste to a wheelie bin in a bag?
The only difference I can see is the bucket doesn’t make the trip to the wheelie bin when a bag is used.
The bucket might need the occasional hose out. No more drama than hosing out a compost bucket on the odd occasion.

I get what you’re saying. My wife thinks the same and I am losing that battle here. I’ll challenge the logic when the store of shopping bags run out. I’m giving the logic a bit of a test run and refinement here.
It's easier for flies to nest in the open rubbish and it goes all over the place when it gets emptied into the rubbish trucks. My next door neighbour just throws loose rubbish in the bin and it always gets blown onto my side of the footpath when it's emptied and I'm sure people that work in commercial environments like emptying other peoples rubbish when it loose in bins, you know things like snot rags and left over food that people have had in their gobs. I believe plastic shopping bags aren't the problem in the bigger picture and they make things more convenient, like the same way motor cars do.

Why not pick on plastic packaging and how many plastic bags does it take to make a plastic bucket and where does your bucket go when it gets old. I normally just hang an old shopping bag up and put rubbish in it then knot it when I'm finished and throw it in the wheelie bin. Media claims that we use about 1 million plastic bottles a minute. We could use glass bottles but wait, we can't recycle glass even though we really can but the cost is too high. You know all that natural gas we need for fired furnaces to recycle glass from Qld that goes overseas and just gets burnt into the atmosphere by someone else, then we are happy to buy the goods they make, well it makes these sort of jobs of recycling obsolete. I just think making people pay for shopping bags is one less cost to giant corporations.

This is a picture of the Cooks River in NSW.

cooks.jpg
 
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John U

MTB Precision
Why not reuse glass bottles instead of recycling? 30 years ago beer bottles would be cleaned and used again. If we had the technology to do it then then surely we have the technology to do it now.
 

pink poodle

Our man in Japan
Why not reuse glass bottles instead of recycling? 30 years ago beer bottles would be cleaned and used again. If we had the technology to do it then then surely we have the technology to do it now.
Jesus man! We aren't scabs...we are rich!!! Ain't nobody got time for that...same with milk bottles.
 

Flow-Rider

Wheel size expert
Why not reuse glass bottles instead of recycling? 30 years ago beer bottles would be cleaned and used again. If we had the technology to do it then then surely we have the technology to do it now.
That would have been the sensible thing to do, even milk bottles were back in the day. Probably see more broken glass around though rather than plastic bottles.
 

LPG

Likes Dirt
Why not reuse glass bottles instead of recycling? 30 years ago beer bottles would be cleaned and used again. If we had the technology to do it then then surely we have the technology to do it now.
They do that in parts of western europe. Breweries typically use a standard bottle that actually has some strength. They are cleaned and reused at the brewery. People typically buy a case of beer that are similar to milk cratea. You pay for the crate bottle and beer at the shop and get refunded for the bottle and crate when you return them. Simple and effective but could be a vit more of a challenge when the beer people drink is less likely to be local
 

nzhumpy

Googlemeister who likes bikes and scandal
They do that in parts of western europe. Breweries typically use a standard bottle that actually has some strength. They are cleaned and reused at the brewery. People typically buy a case of beer that are similar to milk cratea. You pay for the crate bottle and beer at the shop and get refunded for the bottle and crate when you return them. Simple and effective but could be a vit more of a challenge when the beer people drink is less likely to be local
Same in NZ, swappa crate, only long necks though.
 

pink poodle

Our man in Japan
CSR had a monopoly on glass in Australia for a long time. There isn't as much profit in reducing, reusing, or recycling.
 

ozzybmx

Likes Bikes and Dirt
There you go, recycle schemes per state...

SA - Since 1977
NT - Since 2011
NSW - Since Dec 2017
ACT - Started June 2018
QLD - Starts Nov 2018
WA - Starts Jan 2019
VIC - None planned
TAS - None planned

https://recyclingnearyou.com.au/containerdeposit/

I remember when it was only SA mentioned on bottles and cans, then it changed to SA/NT, so by Jan 2019 this will include NSW, WA, QLD and ACT. It makes a massive difference to the rubbish around the city, there are dozens of night shift cleaners with their shopping trolleys, cleaning the streets and plundering common waste bins for bottles, cans and cartons that would normally go to landfill, to cash in on the 10c per container. Hopefully country wide very soon.
 

flamin'trek

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Also if you are having trouble going bagless on the bins from fear of good, you can line it with newspaper or keep newspaper near by to wrap the gooey stuff up before placing it in your bin. Keep a can of glen20 or similar near by and give the bin a quick spray between loads to reduce how often you need to wash it.
Only one problem with that plan. Haven’t had any newspaper in this household for years. Don’t buy them anymore and I’m fairly sure it is going to get expensive trying to wrap it in iPads.
 

Dozer

Heavy machinery.
Staff member
The ban on single use plastic bags is awesome. Great to finally see some action.
It's a total pile of shit that is making supermarkets money. Everyone thinks they are being awesome humans and caring for the environment just 'cause it's the current trend and in thing to do.
I've rambled on about this a bit but I have now got more plastic bags from supermarkets going into the rubbish than ever before. How so you ask? The piece of shit bag I have to now use is bigger, thicker and heavier. You can only put in one bag what you can carry weight wise so I'm needing the same amount of weight packed in thicker bags; it equals more plastic that I'm throwing in the bin as I cannot hand the bags back for them to be recycled.
Aside from the political agenda behind this bullshit plastic bag trend, the one thing that pisses me off is I don't have the reliable old plastic shopping bag stash that I use to pick up my dog shits twice a day. Whats my alternative? I now buy freezer bags and use them instead or grab a heap of the plastic bags offered at beach entries in my town to pick up dog shit from the beach.
Aside from my obvious stab at those jumping on the fucking band wagon with this bag hype, I still say the problem isn't the damn bag but it's the person putting the bag somewhere other than a rubbish bin. It's the pricks that chuck bottle wherever they want, it's the stinking shithead fisherman that throw their empty plastic bait bag over their shoulder, the mongrels that unwrap a pack of ciggies and throw the plastic, the shitheads with their gel wrappers etc etc. If all that rubbish goes into a bin and is dealt with by an appropriate resource to manage plastic waste then we could actually have a reputable system that either recycles it for future use again and again or it is turned into cheap double plugger thongs.
The current marketing suggesting single use plastic are banned is laughable, it isn't changing anything.
 

safreek

Vealcake
It's a total pile of shit that is making supermarkets money. Everyone thinks they are being awesome humans and caring for the environment just 'cause it's the current trend and in thing to do.
I've rambled on about this a bit but I have now got more plastic bags from supermarkets going into the rubbish than ever before. How so you ask? The piece of shit bag I have to now use is bigger, thicker and heavier. You can only put in one bag what you can carry weight wise so I'm needing the same amount of weight packed in thicker bags; it equals more plastic that I'm throwing in the bin as I cannot hand the bags back for them to be recycled.
Aside from the political agenda behind this bullshit plastic bag trend, the one thing that pisses me off is I don't have the reliable old plastic shopping bag stash that I use to pick up my dog shits twice a day. Whats my alternative? I now buy freezer bags and use them instead or grab a heap of the plastic bags offered at beach entries in my town to pick up dog shit from the beach.
Aside from my obvious stab at those jumping on the fucking band wagon with this bag hype, I still say the problem isn't the damn bag but it's the person putting the bag somewhere other than a rubbish bin. It's the pricks that chuck bottle wherever they want, it's the stinking shithead fisherman that throw their empty plastic bait bag over their shoulder, the mongrels that unwrap a pack of ciggies and throw the plastic, the shitheads with their gel wrappers etc etc. If all that rubbish goes into a bin and is dealt with by an appropriate resource to manage plastic waste then we could actually have a reputable system that either recycles it for future use again and again or it is turned into cheap double plugger thongs.
The current marketing suggesting single use plastic are banned is laughable, it isn't changing anything.
At least its giving me heavy duty bags to choke dolphins with, had one of them scare the shit out of me when I was 15, bastard snuck up on me looking like a shark.
Never forgiven them for that, remember the Simpson dolphin episode
 

droenn

Likes Bikes and Dirt
We stopped using single use plastic bags years ago. I really struggle to understand how anyone is against changing over to better practices. Hiding behind "its a money making scheme" is just trying to shift responsibility away from being too lazy to make a few simple changes.

Our dog poop bags are all plant-based biodegradable/compostable, our bin liners are the same. Our shopping bags are now mostly calico tote bags, and a few heavy duty plastic ones that we reuse until they are falling apart. Which is quite a while actually: in the same time we would have gone through dozens of single use.
 

Calvin27

Eats Squid
I welcome the advance but have a few issues
It's a total pile of shit that is making supermarkets money. Everyone thinks they are being awesome humans and caring for the environment just 'cause it's the current trend and in thing to do.
+1.

As a person who works in the environment space this is a complete nonsense policy.

I'll add that we have never solves any environmental problems by actions that make it less convenient. It fails because our economic systems are consumption based. All solutions to date have largely been technology based that meet the existing levels of amenity and convenience.
 

Tubbsy

Party Pooper
Staff member
I'm with Droenn on this one.

Since moving to Canberra, our single use plastic bag count has plummeted - having to pay for bags at the checkout was a little reminder for the first week, and now we always take heavy-duty hessian bags shopping. They hold as much weight as I can carry, don't dig uncomfortably into my soft un-workmanlike hands and don't wear out.

Pretty much all fresh food waste goes in the compost, and we try and buy as little overly-packaged food as possible.

Perhaps there is an element of supermarket profiteering, I don't know. But I'm using far less pointless plastic and that has to be a good thing.
 

Flow-Rider

Wheel size expert
We stopped using single use plastic bags years ago. I really struggle to understand how anyone is against changing over to better practices. Hiding behind "its a money making scheme" is just trying to shift responsibility away from being too lazy to make a few simple changes..
It's because it's contradictive, what does your milk and bread come packaged in at the supermarket and things that don't need be like shaving razors. They've picked out one piece that's merely significant to a large puzzle and said there you go we're doing a great thing for the world but still sell a large range of products in plastic bags or containers to suit themselves for making a profit.
 

Tubbsy

Party Pooper
Staff member
The large supermarket chains are obviously companies whose aim is to make as much money as possible while pissing off as few customers as they can. If they're being disingenuous in their marketing of the plastic bag thing, so be it. Doesn't mean we need to use the bags.

As a consumer, you can choose to buy your bread in plastic or paper, or indeed no packaging at all. Milk you can get in cartons. Razors might be tougher, and indeed there's plenty of shit that is massively over-packaged.

But there's no point in waiting for Coles and Woolies to sort this out for us.

As an individual one can make choices that cut down on waste.
 

droenn

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I take issue with focusing all this resistance towards changing practice, just because its implemented by large supermarkets and requires you to change a few simple behaviors. Ideally you should be looking at all the single use plastics in your life and how you can reduce them. Bags are hopefully a first step towards this and other things will follow.

Overall its not hard to reduce a number of plastics. Swap over to bamboo toothbrushes, cakes of soap instead of bottled liquid ones, bread from the bakery, buy the peanut butter in the glass jar instead of plastic etc. Don't have to be perfect, just change a few things, and don't think you're changing the world with it, you're just reducing a few things with minimal effort.
 

Dozer

Heavy machinery.
Staff member
We stopped using single use plastic bags years ago. I really struggle to understand how anyone is against changing over to better practices. Hiding behind "its a money making scheme" is just trying to shift responsibility away from being too lazy to make a few simple changes.
I would love to do more and full credit to you for making the extra effort to do it. A problem for me is, all that stuff is a lot dearer to have and I just won't spend my money on it. I'd rather spend what spare funds I have each week on things I enjoy and I think I do a lot more practical things are aimed at spending time outside enjoying this awesome planet. Actually, I could guarantee I've done more good for this planet in one year than 99% of people living in a concrete jungle in a city. I've got an amazing garden that I designed and planted over a few years and I maintain the adjoining and surrounding reserves just 'cause I want to see the birds each day and I like the look of it. I spend waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more time in local forests doing good things than Joe Blow and I pick upany rubbish I see and chuck it in my bin. Now we have folks saying what we put in our bin is a problem? Fuck off it is, it's better rotting in a waste facility than it is choking some wildlife and decimating a species just because some dipshit can't file his rubbish properly.
Sorry, that sounded like an attack on you Droenn, I don't mean it like that, just generalizing. ;)
For the record, I do my grocery shopping online and I pick my groceries up. I have no option using that process other than to use the bags. I've asked for my groceries to be put in a trolley with no bags at all so I can save the $1 on the heaps of shit but nah, Woolies isn't that forward thinking. I mentioned this elsewhere; I am not able to use those bags, bring them back to be recycled and feel good about it. They do not accept the bags back, it's a total load of shit. The alternatives? I could spend $15 to have it delivered and unpack the crates but nah, thats a coffee for me, some raisin toast and a bowl of strawberries for my dog while we sit back next to the sea under the shade of a tree. I could go instore and get my groceries? Nah, supermarkets are like airports in that people lose their manners and respect and act like uneducated arseholes.
A lot of people make an effort in some way to prolong the life of this big ball we live on. All of it counts for something and everyone should be proud to do at least one little thing. The naysayers can eat a shit sandwich though, I'll argue with anyone that Woolies and Coles are doing this bag thing for two reasons: Likes on Facebook and to make money. One of those points is pretty critical to surviving in business, the other is just an imaginary friend.
 
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