Suspension Setup Sag/Travel

Tubbsy

Tubbsy

Packin' a small bird
Staff member
That does sound odd, but if you had a linkage/bearing issue preventing full travel it would probably ride like shit and make a lot of noise. In my experience you don't ever feel a harsh bottom out on the DW link.

Take the opportunity to have cyclinic or someone do the service and check everything out while the shock's off.

Doing the bearings is tedious (just did mine), but if it's the first time round for your frame, being an LS it's a few years old and probably overdue..
 
K

Kerplunk

Likes Bikes and Dirt
AaronJ said:
Thanks for the info Tubbsy.

Def 100% not using all the shock's travel. Fully compressed to extended there is 45-46mm of stanchion from the seal lip. My o-ring moves from the seal lip to at best 36mm (measured with a vernier I should add).

Plus, with my woes to get it dialed in I have checked/changed pressure, measured sag, travel post ride and travel giving it a big pump after each ride. I have the spreadsheet to prove it ;-)

Does not matter how I measure, were I set it, etc, I just cant get any more travel out if it under reasonable pressures.

A thought.../ I have not checked the rear suspension's bearings. What if something was limiting travel, without giving a feeling of bottoming???
Click to expand...
Sounds like the suspension on the Ripley is designed with a strong pedal platform in mind rather than squish. Which probably means the shock sits higher in the stroke and takes a fair hit break away into the mid stroke.. Might explain why it’s hard to get full travel..
I had the same issue on my intense primer with a rockshox monarch.. Couldn’t even get close to full travel.. I have ended up running 33-34% sag rather than the recommended 30%. With no volume spacers. I still get the pedal support but the shock now sits in the more supple part of the stroke. I can now use full travel on features that deserve it.
It took bloody ages to get it right.. Balancing pedal strikes, with pedal efficiency and getting full travel..
I reckon start by increasing sag incrementally.
I let the air out of the shock/compressed it fully then used some electrical tape to mark the portion of the shaft that couldn’t be used (shock stroke was limited).. That way I could easily see how much I was using when out on the trail while add/subtracting pressure..
 
hifiandmtb

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
All I have to say is that I loved my OG XL Ripley, awesome bike. But I missed that high speed hard hit suppleness, when set up how it should be (sag wise) it would get spikey on repeated hits. And this was with a properly functional Monarch RT3 Debonair:

361872


I'm sure there's a way to get it closer to perfect.

I just went a Ripmo instead...
 
leitch

leitch

Feelin' a bit rrranty
AaronJ said:
A thought.../ I have not checked the rear suspension's bearings. What if something was limiting travel, without giving a feeling of bottoming???
Click to expand...
Easy enough to check that by depressurising the shock and cycling the linkage through the travel feeling for rough spots/resistance... take note of where the shock bottoms out while you’re at it.

Just noticed you said you’re getting to 70-80% by “bouncing on it to test travel”. Don’t want to patronise and I’m sure you’ve done loads of riding on the bike in the time since you started this thread but if you’re getting 80% travel in a carpark test you’re probably not actually that far off where you want to be for hitting trail features at speed...

As @Kerplunk said maybe try ignoring the Ibis 25% target, go to 30-33% and use the 3pos adjuster if you find you need a little bit more support in open mode once you’re on the trail.
 
A

AaronJ

Likes Dirt
Yes I know... I keep dragging this post on. One last try before I just start ringing the suspension shops (will prob do that anyway).

Have listened to all of your advice, but, it still does not stack up.

I am measuring correctly/consistently and I cannot get this thing into its last 5-6mm of travel (9-14%).

Heres the summary so far:
  • The shock on the 2017 Ripley LS has/uses 44mm of travel (2017 Fox Float Factory DPS EVOL, 190x45).
  • Mine has no tokens/spacers.
  • I have de-aired the shock on the frame to confirm that it bottoms right on 44mm and the suspension bearings are smooth through the full travel range.
  • Ibis says to aim for 25% travel (11mm), but most heavier riders struggle to get that and end up around 30% sag at a psi around 20-30psi higher than Ibis spec for rider weight.
  • I have mine at about 30% sag now, me seated/weight balanced, with 245psi
  • As with my first dot-point above, I measure sag and travel using a vernier from the seal/air can interface to where the o-ring stops. I use the same method no matter where I measure bottom-out, travel or sag.
  • No matter how hard I drop or bounce on the shock, the most I can get it to travel is 38.5mm (87.5%)
Given the basic idea of spacers is that if you have correct sag and are bottoming, add spacers. If not reaching full travel, remove spacers. I have no spacers, so what the heck heck is going on?

It is behaving like it has too much bottoming resistance.

I bought the bike of the orig owner that was about 20kg lighter than me and did some XC races on it (I removed spacers from the fork and its a very light build/spec). At the time, it was mentioned it had upgraded internals of some description, but I never thought to ask what. Could the shock's seeming high bottoming resistance be consistent with some kind of custom tuning for a lighter more pedalling-oriented rider???

I cant think of any other explanation for it.
 
beeb

beeb

Dr. Beebenson, PhD HA, ST, Offset (hons)
You should be setting your sag in the "attack" position, not while seated. Setting it while seated is setting it while your body weight is in a more rearward position than when you're descending through gnarlier bits of trail, and doing so will end up with a setting with excess pressure in the shock. Try to set the sag while in a standing 3/4 "attack" position. IMO this gives the best all around sag point. You will almost certainly have to lean the ends off the bars against a wall while doing this, and hold the front brake to keep the bike still. Try to avoid using the rear brake as that may somewhat bind the linkage, and also try to avoid accidentally bouncing the bike while climbing aboard. Then take note of the pressure setting so you have a good baseline and can trim up or down a few psi as needed.
 
A

AaronJ

Likes Dirt
beeb said:
You should be setting your sag in the "attack" position, not while seated
Click to expand...
I get the sense that makes, but its not what Ibis describe (sit in normal rising position) and not what most videos I've seen describe.

I.e. most are seated for rear, attack for front.

Wouldn't in your scenario, if you have rear sag set when you are weighted 3/4 forward, mean when you sit to climb, you'll be in the lower portion of the sock's travel?

Either way... think I'm going to just run a service kit through fork and shock first and then see where its at then.
 
beeb

beeb

Dr. Beebenson, PhD HA, ST, Offset (hons)
AaronJ said:
Wouldn't in your scenario, if you have rear sag set when you are weighted 3/4 forward, mean when you sit to climb, you'll be in the lower portion of the shock's travel?
Click to expand...
True, it'll probably sit a couple of percent lower, but generally not massively different in my experience. Makes a noticeable difference to attack position balance IMO though as it's rough terrain where it'll have more effect. Seated climbing is generally a fairly stable state for the bike, so as long as your pedalling technique is fairly smooth it may not be the end of the world on a short travel bike like the Ripley. Worth a shot anyway!
 
K

Kerplunk

Likes Bikes and Dirt
AaronJ said:
Yes I know... I keep dragging this post on. One last try before I just start ringing the suspension shops (will prob do that anyway).

Have listened to all of your advice, but, it still does not stack up.

I am measuring correctly/consistently and I cannot get this thing into its last 5-6mm of travel (9-14%).

Heres the summary so far:
  • The shock on the 2017 Ripley LS has/uses 44mm of travel (2017 Fox Float Factory DPS EVOL, 190x45).
  • Mine has no tokens/spacers.
  • I have de-aired the shock on the frame to confirm that it bottoms right on 44mm and the suspension bearings are smooth through the full travel range.
  • Ibis says to aim for 25% travel (11mm), but most heavier riders struggle to get that and end up around 30% sag at a psi around 20-30psi higher than Ibis spec for rider weight.
  • I have mine at about 30% sag now, me seated/weight balanced, with 245psi
  • As with my first dot-point above, I measure sag and travel using a vernier from the seal/air can interface to where the o-ring stops. I use the same method no matter where I measure bottom-out, travel or sag.
  • No matter how hard I drop or bounce on the shock, the most I can get it to travel is 38.5mm (87.5%)
Given the basic idea of spacers is that if you have correct sag and are bottoming, add spacers. If not reaching full travel, remove spacers. I have no spacers, so what the heck heck is going on?

It is behaving like it has too much bottoming resistance.

I bought the bike of the orig owner that was about 20kg lighter than me and did some XC races on it (I removed spacers from the fork and its a very light build/spec). At the time, it was mentioned it had upgraded internals of some description, but I never thought to ask what. Could the shock's seeming high bottoming resistance be consistent with some kind of custom tuning for a lighter more pedalling-oriented rider???

I cant think of any other explanation for it.
Click to expand...
What happens when you run 35% sag?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top