Travelling through europe

[stevo78]

Planning my European adventure for next April and was curious as to what other people have done.
Still deciding on whether to fly over with my bike and hire a car or camper and drive around staying at cheap accommodation.
Or is it better to use public transport and hire a bike while over there for the periods I want to ride.
Like the idea of a campervan but not sure if there are some negatives that I havent thought of.
Any tips or advice would be great as its y first time to Europe.

 

[Bryce88]

Planning my European adventure for next April and was curious as to what other people have done.
Still deciding on whether to fly over with my bike and hire a car or camper and drive around staying at cheap accommodation.
Or is it better to use public transport and hire a bike while over there for the periods I want to ride.
Like the idea of a campervan but not sure if there are some negatives that I havent thought of.
Any tips or advice would be great as its y first time to Europe.

When the missus and I were over there we relied on public transport. We thought about hiring a car but didn't want to deal with the stress of driving everywhere, getting lost, finding car parks etc. We travelled through France & Italy and 95% of travel was done by train.

If you are just doing tourist stuff through Europe the trains take you everywhere you want to go and are super easy. If you want to explore outside of that your best bet is to probably hire a car/camper. Of the public transport I found the trains were the best by far. Cabs were okay but be careful they don't try and rip you off. Traveling by bus I always found a nightmare.

On the bike front though I am not sure what the rules are with public transport or where/if you can hire bikes, sorry.

Europe is awesome, just beware of the people trying to scam you as it can leave a sour taste in your mouth (lots of scammers like the deaf mutes, gypsy's, train beggars, bracelets makers etc). After a couple days you will soon switch on to what's going on generally as soon as you firmly say ''no'' they will leave you alone. If that doesn't work just mention the Police and they will instantly vanish.

Make sure you learn a few words like thank you, hello, excuse me and please help for whatever country you visit. It makes a huge difference and people are more inclined to help you. Most Europeans speak quite good english but most will ignore you unless attempt to speak their native tongue. Also, make sure people don't mistake you for an American. It is amazing how there attitudes change when they realise you are an Aussie.

Oh, we also pre-booked our accomodation in Australia as we found it the cheapest option. Nice rooms were costing us about $75 AUS a night.

Enjoy your adventure. It is amazing over there. I hope to get back over there one day.

 

[Haakon]

Depends how long you're going for. A couple of weeks and want to cover a lot of ground? Rent a car.

Happy to hang around one or two areas? Take your bike.

Going for six months? Buy a car or get a long term lease/rental (such as http://eurogroup.com.au/eurodrive.html http://www.renaulteurodrive.com.au/default.aspx)


We did it 15 years ago - bought a crappy reno station wagon in London for 800 quid that we could sleep in, did Loch Ness to Athens in six months. Stayed mostly at camping grounds - safe camping, showers etc, somewhere to leave the car and catch a bus into towns.

 

[schred]

My buddy bought a kombi camper for a spain/euro adventure about 5yrs ago, it worked out cheaper that way. Until the engine took a dump and wrote itself off. Had to liquidate what remained of the van to cover the purchase price, adventure over, split with partner. Ha ha, no really it is funny with a sidestory, don't worry.

I'm sure the economics between options exist but it's blurry, the risk you take on with a purchase, you can mitigate with a rental. Likewise for taking your bike over vs renting, unless you have a dream of doing a WC course on your bike, I'd weigh that up too. Carrying a nice bike around Europe between hostels and their inhabitants, no thanks.

Still, have a ball, plan loosely, trust your gut and go, that's the joy of it imo.

 

[steve24]

Where do you plan to travel?
Just you, partner?, family?

I spend a lot of time in Europe (Austria, Italy, Germany...).

For a single traveller private rooms can be had for about euro 20/night with breakfast but you won't find these prices any where near cities.

If I was going alone I would bike/ train but it really depends what/ where you are thinking and how long you want to travel.

Also consider going a bit later, weather will still be cold and some of the best alpine riding will still be under snow. Most mountain huts will also be closed in the season between snow and summer....

Car rental is quite cheap. We will be in France in June and will rent a car for around euro 200 for a week big enough for 4 and a bike.....

 

[Grundos]

I recently did some travelling and riding in Europe with my own bike. Apart from carpooling from Geneva to Morzine with some mates and getting the shuttle back to Geneva, I was catching trains to get around.
How much riding are you planning on doing? If you intend on taking your own bike and riding multiple destinations, hiring or buying a car is definitely the way to go. Lugging a big, heavy bike box around Europe is not fun. That said, if you take the public transport + own bike option and want to leave the bike somewhere, the bigger cities usually have a storage room where you can leave your bike; I stashed mine at Munich station for a week, cost me about 60 euros. Sending it back as airmail though is pretty much out of the question; you're looking at about 850 euros for that.

Make sure you learn a few words like thank you, hello, excuse me and please help for whatever country you visit. It makes a huge difference and people are more inclined to help you. Most Europeans speak quite good english but most will ignore you unless attempt to speak their native tongue. Also, make sure people don't mistake you for an American. It is amazing how there attitudes change when they realise you are an Aussie.

The language thing really depends where you go. In my experience, the French tend to appreciate you trying to use the language and will try to make sense out of what little you know. The Germans, however, will readily switch to English the moment they realise you suck at their language.

 

[mars mtb]

Hey Stevo,

In 2011 I went to France and Italy for 8 weeks with the family and I took my bike. We primarily travelled by train and had a car for a couple of weeks. Driving the car is just a bloody hassle with parking unles you are in the country, for example in fortified towns or historic towns cars are not allowed and you have to park them on the outskirts in a car park then travel in.

This year 2014 we went again to France and Italy for 7 weeks and I took my bike. This time we did it mostly by train and then hired private taxi for certain legs. It was more cost effective this way when you plan it all from Australia. It also helps if you can speak the languages.

Re taking your bike on trains, if it is not bagged up you may have to pay, when I say may, it depends what mood the inspectors are in, it's France and Italy. Down side is they may not actually let you on if the train is packed. If however you have a bike bag that is considered luggage and so it is just another bag albeit a bit bigger than your suitcase per se and you don't have to pay for the bike bag on the trains with your prebooked tickets. The only time I had to pay for my bike bag was on the water taxi in Venice, €7 only.

Also check baggage limits on the airlines because that will smash you. I found Emirates 30kg baggage allowance per person across the family more than covered all our luggage and bike bag with room to spare. The key here is to use a travel agent to book your flights all on the one booking ticket, for example if you need to get back to Rome from Catania you can only fly Alitalia so get it all done on the booking for the agent. That way Alitalia can't charge you for the bike bag for that leg back to Rome if you needed such a journey.

I am most happy I took my bike on both occasions, the bike bag was awesome, am happy I didn't have to drive or think where I had to go, I just had to make the trains in time. Practice up on the language if you can't speak either, the effort alone will get you respect and help.

If you need a bike bag, I'll be flogging mine if you can't get one local or don't have one.

If by chance you are landing in Nice, France, great place but prebook a vehicle to pick you up as all the taxi drivers have Mercs and BMW X5s all new and they will give you grief and try and split the family into 2 cars and charge you heaps. You can get a Merc Viano 7 seater to take the family and all you bags and bike bag for €30 your hotel will arrange this for you.

Hope that helps.

 

[steve24]

A Swiss conductor refused to let me on a train last year with bike. With a minute to go I was begging as I needed to make the train to meet up with my family in Austria. She was unmoved and would not let me on. With 20 seconds to go I whipped off the front wheel announcing bike was my baggage. She asks if I have a bag for it? Sure I say. OK, no problem. Got on the train as it started moving while trying to fit it into a garbage bag I carry....
Avoid Switzerland, most expensive country in central Europe....

Stevo, you still in Adelaide?

 

[stevo78]

Thanks for all the great advice guys.
Plans are still pretty vague at the moment. Plan on following the Spring classics in France and Belgium during April but also may head to the Alps if the weather permits but being April it could well be still snowing. Was looking to base myself in Grenoble and riding some of the famous peaks from there then head to Northern france/Belgium for the Ardennes classics and also spend Anzac somewhere.
Don't plan on the trip being too structured so I have the flexibility to change plans.
At this stage I will have 4 weeks there and plan on riding a lot, its a riding holiday and plan on seeing the sights mostly by bike.
First major overseas trip and going by myself so a little bit daunting.
Have booked in to learn French so that will help I hope.
Yes still in Adelaide for the moment Steve24

 

[Haakon]

My buddy bought a kombi camper for a spain/euro adventure about 5yrs ago, it worked out cheaper that way. Until the engine took a dump and wrote itself off. Had to liquidate what remained of the van to cover the purchase price, adventure over, split with partner. Ha ha, no really it is funny with a sidestory, don't worry.

I was lucky with the car I bought (plus I'm a reno nut and knew what I was looking at when I bought it). It did pop a CV joint boot in Greece and I got it back to the UK by stopping every hundred kms and poking more grease in the CV joint!

It all worked out, but if the old girl had dropped dead it would have been a bummer - I'm a bit older and lazier now and would spend the extra coin and get a renaultdrive lease thingy.

 

[mars mtb]

Thanks for all the great advice guys.
Plans are still pretty vague at the moment. Plan on following the Spring classics in France and Belgium during April but also may head to the Alps if the weather permits but being April it could well be still snowing. Was looking to base myself in Grenoble and riding some of the famous peaks from there then head to Northern france/Belgium for the Ardennes classics and also spend Anzac somewhere.
Don't plan on the trip being too structured so I have the flexibility to change plans.
At this stage I will have 4 weeks there and plan on riding a lot, its a riding holiday and plan on seeing the sights mostly by bike.
First major overseas trip and going by myself so a little bit daunting.
Have booked in to learn French so that will help I hope.
Yes still in Adelaide for the moment Steve24

Hey Steve,

If you are basing yourself in Grenoble at the start of your trip then look at landing in Nice, heaps of Nice riding, Col d'Eze, Col de la Madone, Col de Turini, Col de Braus etc, then train to Grenoble. From Grenoble you can ride local hills Col du Porte etc, but to head to Alpe d'Huez and the rest out there you need to get to Bourg d'Oisans. It is 55km and whilst the motorists in the hills are nice to riders, the roads out there is no shoulder and they will not tolerate you riding, that is they'll drive you into the gravel no question. To make it you need to take a massive detour that adds heaps of kms that will smash you before you arrive for your first climb.

So you will need a car for a few days if heading out there a few times from Grenoble. Book them here and the rental cars are all at the train station and then walk up the road 5 mins to get the car. Grenoble on a Sunday shuts down, only food places are open and bakeries close at midday if they open at all, so too super markets, so stock up.

Take layers and a ripper rain jacket.

 

[Grundos]

Take layers and a ripper rain jacket.

This cannot be emphasised enough. I was in Morzine for 7 days, and during that time I saw the sun for a grand total of about 10 seconds.

 

[wilso1]

This cannot be emphasised enough. I was in Morzine for 7 days, and during that time I saw the sun for a grand total of about 10 seconds.

+1. That sounds like my week there in July.......

I've just come back from two years in London with a few side trips to France and Belgium for cycling (7 & 9yo in tow). Tips might vary whether you're prefering to do more road or downhill, but here's what I can suggest.
- the weather could be anything. We went to Tour of Flanders both years: 2013 was 5deg and kind of unpleasant, 2013 was 15deg and quite nice (and Gent-Wevelgem the week earlier in 2013 was 23deg and BEAUTIFUL!).
- I know EuroStar does charge additional for bikes, or anything above normal suitcase size (just like an airline really). I would guess the French railway (SNCF) is the same but can't confirm.
- I hired a road bike in Morzine (carbon Giant Defy with Ultegra) for €220 for the week. Mtb started at €40/day, but the price comes down if you hire for a week. Unless you've got a bike you really want to take I'd suggest hiring.
- However, if this adds up to too much would you consider buying a bike (Canyon?) over there (perhaps ordering it beforehand and delivered to your accommodation?)
- We found some nice places on the continent through AirBNB, but don't book anything property that doesn't carry a photo of their bathroom. It could be WAAAAY smaller than you ever thought possible.
- I'll second someone elses comments about staying in old towns in Italy - if you can get your car in you won't be able to park it there. In Siena parking was €2/hr just outside the city walls, or €5/day at the bottom of the hill, but there is a bus. We insisted on accommodation with parking and caught the bus into the old town.
- If you do hire a car then look up insurance4carhire, which enables you to pay £40 for a years worth of car hire insurance excess coverage
- We had brand new hire cars in Italy & UK at the start of the summer season (April-May). They must turn their fleet over at the start of the summer.
Happy to help further if you think my experience lines up with what you were looking at doing.

 

[stevo78]

Thanks for some great advice Wilso1. Mostly road riding but would be great to get in some dirt on the way
Ideally imI'm looking for good places to stay for a week that I can ride straight from the accommodation and somewhere I can hire a bike. Like to see Roubaix and then the amstel gold race and liege bastogne liege. Other than that it will depend on the weather as to how much I ride.

 

[whitey89]

Hey dude, ive done it twice taking my DH bike and using public transport. Managed to get to spend a week in Shladming, Leogang, Porte du soleil (morzine). Its really easy.

PM me if you have any questions

 

[dolphinman]

+1. That sounds like my week there in July.......

I've just come back from two years in London with a few side trips to France and Belgium for cycling (7 & 9yo in tow). Tips might vary whether you're prefering to do more road or downhill, but here's what I can suggest.
- the weather could be anything. We went to Tour of Flanders both years: 2013 was 5deg and kind of unpleasant, 2013 was 15deg and quite nice (and Gent-Wevelgem the week earlier in 2013 was 23deg and BEAUTIFUL!).
- I know EuroStar does charge additional for bikes, or anything above normal suitcase size (just like an airline really). I would guess the French railway (SNCF) is the same but can't confirm.
- I hired a road bike in Morzine (carbon Giant Defy with Ultegra) for €220 for the week. Mtb started at €40/day, but the price comes down if you hire for a week. Unless you've got a bike you really want to take I'd suggest hiring.
- However, if this adds up to too much would you consider buying a bike (Canyon?) over there (perhaps ordering it beforehand and delivered to your accommodation?)
- We found some nice places on the continent through AirBNB, but don't book anything property that doesn't carry a photo of their bathroom. It could be WAAAAY smaller than you ever thought possible.
- I'll second someone elses comments about staying in old towns in Italy - if you can get your car in you won't be able to park it there. In Siena parking was €2/hr just outside the city walls, or €5/day at the bottom of the hill, but there is a bus. We insisted on accommodation with parking and caught the bus into the old town.
- If you do hire a car then look up insurance4carhire, which enables you to pay £40 for a years worth of car hire insurance excess coverage
- We had brand new hire cars in Italy & UK at the start of the summer season (April-May). They must turn their fleet over at the start of the summer.
Happy to help further if you think my experience lines up with what you were looking at doing.

Lines up with mine for sure. Looking like 2 yrs on the German/dutch border with an 8yr old and 4 yr old from June. Aim is for plenty of cycle touring. Any cycle touring tips with kids you can recommend (sorry for thread Hijack).

 

[wilso1]

Thanks for some great advice Wilso1. Mostly road riding but would be great to get in some dirt on the way
Ideally imI'm looking for good places to stay for a week that I can ride straight from the accommodation and somewhere I can hire a bike. Like to see Roubaix and then the amstel gold race and liege bastogne liege. Other than that it will depend on the weather as to how much I ride.

Happy those tidbits helped.
I'm beginning to wonder whether you would get much downhill in at that time of year. The ski season wraps around Easter which typically overlaps with the Spring Classics, so I think the resorts and chairlifts will still be in 'winter' mode. So maybe you'll be chasing more XC than downhill? In which case I've pretty much run out of advice!

On the Spring Classics I'm a bit better placed though. Most of the races are detailed through this website http://www.rondevanvlaanderen.be/en but it doesn't have any information on Paris-Roubaix or Liege-Bastogne-Liege (organised by ASO or someone else?). And the Amstel Gold race is later? I can't recall. But the classics take in 4-5 weeks, adding another two weeks if you include the Italian races. That's looking a bit longer than your 4 weeks.
A few of the pro teams base themselves in Kortrijk for the classics as it's central to the classics area, but a lot of the villages are pretty close together. For example, we couldn't get accommodation in Ypres one weekend so we stayed in the village of Zandvoorde which was 10km down the road. Do-able in a car but probably not with a belly full of Belgian beer. All the Tour of Flanders climbs are between Oudenaarde and Ronse, so you could fill in a week riding those. Most races have an amateur sportive on the Saturday beforehand too. We watched the Tour of Flanders from Kwaremont and the atmosphere really is fantastic, even without being able to drink much Belgian beer as I had to drive back to London that evening.

"Like to see Roubaix?" It's in the middle of a park which is open every day of the year. My son and I made it just before sunset after a day of chasing cobbles. Fantastique!
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