What does less Fork Rake do for you? 2010 Glory 0 vs 2009 0

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
Hey guys just a thread to explain to me why in 2010 the glory has gone to having less rake? What advantages does having less rake do?

When riding my 2010 Glory I feel like it wants to put me over the bars heaps more, especially in the rougher rocky stuff. I know the feeling of my old 2009 Glory just plowing through rock gardens where on numerous occasions my new 2010 wants to put me over the bars.

Any explanation on why they have gone for less this year?
 

bhooper

Barfarker
Well the plow ability is probably because of the weight difference. Some of my mates who have 2010 glorys say that then cant plow as much as they used to be able to because those 2 kilos have been lost....
Hope this helps.
-Ben
 

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
Yeah i was thinking that however im 6 foot 5 and weigh 103kg so 2 kg wont make much difference haha. The bike itself is heaps more poppy and easy to get off the ground tho where the old one stuck down a bit better.

just when pushing through a succession of rocks it doesn't go over the rocks as well.

Still just wanna know the cons of more rake. or the pros of less lol.
 

mr636

Likes Bikes and Dirt
its the old wheel barrow theory. the slacker the angle you use, the better it will go over stuff.
but if you lift the barrow way up high, and try go over stuff it will flip over forwards.

i have a 2010 glory, and have had 2 previous models. the new one seems to sit higher in its rear travel (less sag), and definately doesnt plow as well as the old one. its a completely different bike.
it definately turns sharper and harder than the old bike, no doubt because it has less rake than the old bikes.
i bought mine because i wanted a more agile bike, rather than the old sled.
the new one is fast as if you ride light on the bike, and skip over the top of bumps.
otherwise i just pre jump stuff heaps more than i could on the old bike.

i changed to a softer spring in the back, and noticed it didnt "hang up" on stuff as much. no doubt giving it more sag......
ps im 82kgs 6'1" on a medium frame. running a 450 spring rear, and 1 softer in the 40s.
 

dl79

Likes Dirt
The head angle is the same from the old model to 2010 model. You can check this on the Giant website if you interested in the geometry.

If you are finding yourself getting kicked over the front too much it may also be running too much compression in the rear shock or even running too heavy a spring. I found I had to run a 100lb lighter spring than in my old glory due to the way the new RC4 works with the new suspension design.

The bike doesn't plow through everything with ease like the old one, instead it seems to be more at home skipping over the tops of rock gardens and being jumped through sections.

I personally love my 2010 glory, but it did take a bit of setting up to get the most out of it.

I'm 6 foot and 92kgs riding a medium DHO with an RC4 Found the bike to run best with 35% sag which I need to run a 350lbs spring to get the right amount.

Hey mr 636 i'd recommend trying a much lighter spring than what your'e currently running (if you have the RC4) and you will be pleasently suprised with the results.
 
Last edited:

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
I suppose im more talking about the headangle then the rake of the forks, but the HA has to be less for sure. Yeah i get a feeling in the back like its getting hung up in the first part of the travel heaps more once the dampenning comes in i suppose thats the difference.

I think the spring that comes on the glory fit the sag recommendations perfectly for the RC4, but its the same poundage as the one i was running on my old DHX5, with all the new dampenning you're running more sag to get into the dampenning a bit more? might have to move it into the 30%'s a bit more with this shock.

Are other guys running more?
 

nskz

Likes Dirt
I suppose im more talking about the headangle then the rake of the forks, but the HA has to be less for sure. Yeah i get a feeling in the back like its getting hung up in the first part of the travel heaps more once the dampenning comes in i suppose thats the difference.

I think the spring that comes on the glory fit the sag recommendations perfectly for the RC4, but its the same poundage as the one i was running on my old DHX5, with all the new dampenning you're running more sag to get into the dampenning a bit more? might have to move it into the 30%'s a bit more with this shock.

Are other guys running more?
As dl79 said the head angle on the '09 and '10 glory's is identical (head angle is rake) in a static situation without you sitting on the bike. However the old glory had almost an inch more travel which results in a slacker effective head angle once you're in a dynamic situation. The RC4 also has a lot more adjustments which could lead to some pretty bad results if tuned poorly. I think it's just a matter of playing with spring rates and damper settings until you find a setting that you're comfortable with.
 

norcorulz

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I found I had to run a 100lb lighter spring than in my old glory due to the way the new RC4 works with the new suspension design.
The old glory had a 9.5x3inch shock stroke while the new glory has a 8.75x2.75inch shock. This is why you're running a lighter pound spring.
 
Last edited:

evObda2

Likes Bikes and Dirt
The old glory had a 9.5x3inch shock stroke while the new glory has a 8.75x2.75inch shock. This is why you're running a lighter pound spring.
He is correct, the RC4 also tends to need a slightly lighter spring as well (compared to a DHX5). Usually by 50lb or so depending on frame design, due to the large shaft size.
 

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
Ah ok thats what i thought and talk about when im talking about rake, but i went on the giant site and the geometry section states head angle and frk rake as two seperate geometries. fork rake looks like its a measurement in mm from the front hub horizontally to where it meets the head angle.
 

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
And then why the hell do giant bring both the rc4 and the dhx5 with 500lbs springs!? they should have a lighter spring as a base reference for tuning.
 

hmcleay

Likes Bikes
A steeper head angle will give you faster steering, at the expense of straight line stability.

Remember though, that the 'static' head angle value published by manufacturers can be very different from the true head angle while riding the bike.
By changing your front and rear sags, you should get able to get around +/- 1degree adjustment in the head angle.

Also, most forks allow you to move the stanchions up or down in the crowns.
Take the spring out of the forks, and push them all the way to bottom-out, then adjust the stanchion to allow for 1 or 2mm clearance between the top of the seal and the bottom of the lower crown. This will give you the steepest possible setup.

Alternatively you could push the all the way down, so the top of the stanchions are flush with the top of the upper crown. this will give you your slackest possible setup.
A short head tube and low stack height will allow for more variation between the two extremes.

Once you're happy with your geometry, you can try to 'tune out' any compromises with damper adjustments.

I once saw a 2009 Demo8 (already a long & slack bike) with boxxers on it with the 'drop' crown on top. They guy had the stanchions pushed all the way down to be flush with the top of the drop crown... Crazy!
 

Mr_Gareth

Likes Bikes
Yeah think that should work nicely, im going to give myself some more sag in the rear and do the front up a bit stiffer, that should work awsome. Geeze new gear can be a bit tricky until you understand it properly,
 

atomik_mulisha

Likes Bikes
Fork rake is the distance the front axle is offset from the head angle(the axles sits in front of the fork, not inline with it. Obviously every boxxer etc has the same fork rake, the frame will not effect it)

The 2010 demos have quite a long 445mm chainstay. I own one and i love it apart from the back end. It takes alot more effort to manual and lift the front up out of corners than other bikes iv ridden. I find myself having to get my weight further back rather than being able to just lift the front up in some sections. The steeper head angle may help with cornering but i feel the back end lets it down a little. I guess it makes for a more stable bike at high speed but on most tracks its little benefit. I'm not the tallest guy and ride a medium so it may not make such a difference to others. Chainstay lenght is the same on all sizes. It is though the only complaint i have with the whole bike.
 

mr636

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I'm 6 foot and 92kgs riding a medium DHO with an RC4 Found the bike to run best with 35% sag which I need to run a 350lbs spring to get the right amount.

Hey mr 636 i'd recommend trying a much lighter spring than what your'e currently running (if you have the RC4) and you will be pleasently suprised with the results.
hmm thanks for that. i reckon i could easily run another 50 softer, as the bike still feels like it is slightly over sprung. its doesnt bottom out anywhere tho!! :eek:
 
Top