Which suspension package on which enduro bike

[Oddjob]

So classic first world problem. I have a few 27.5 enduro bikes and have a variety of suspension packages to put on them. Before anyone asks, the Pole is keeping the Avalanche/Vivid combo and the Liteville 301 is sticking to DVO.

The two bikes of interest are a Focus Sam and a SC Nomad 3. The Sam is a squishy faux bar and the Nomad a pretty efficient VPP. I've got a angleset for both to slacken the head angle and an offset bushing for the Sam to get the bb up and steepen the seat angle.

I will probably use the Sam for enduro racing and probably keep the Nomad for heavy duty trail work where I wont be so worried about scratching the carbon.

The Sam is currently running a Fox 36 rc2 and a Float X2 combo. I also have a Lyrik rc fork and a DVO Topaz or CCDBA shock.

My current thinking is to keep the Fox package on the Sam because the Float X2 works well with the faux bar setup. Although I'm thinking of switching the somewhat harsh rc2 damper to a Grip damper.

I found the CCDBA to be under valved for the Sam but would probably work well for the more efficient Nomad. I would then try the Lyrik with the Charger damper and move to a Fast damper if it feels underdone.

Or I could run the Fox setup on the Nomad and run a Lyrik/DVO Topaz combo on the Sam. I'm realy pleased with the Topaz on the Liteville and would expect it to work well on the Sam as well.

Thoughts?



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[DMan]

Truly a first world problem.

 

[teK--]

I'm thinking this cup noodle I'm eating is beyond expectations

 

[Oddjob]

I'm thinking this cup noodle I'm eating is beyond expectations

What flavour?

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[Flow-Rider]

What do you mean by the CCDBA is under valved ?

 

[creaky]

Just arrange them in alphabetical order

 

[Oddjob]

What do you mean by the CCDBA is under valved ?

In stock tune it barely has enough rebound for my weight with lsr/hsr maxed out. I also can't get enough lsc for the Sam. Would need to beef up the shim stack to make it work on the Sam.

The Float X2 on the other hand has enough range of adjustment with the standard tune.

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[Flow-Rider]

In stock tune it barely has enough rebound for my weight with lsr/hsr maxed out. I also can't get enough lsc for the Sam. Would need to beef up the shim stack to make it work on the Sam.

The Float X2 on the other hand has enough range of adjustment with the standard tune.

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It might need a service. I have plenty of range on my inline and I'm about 89kg kitted up ATM. I don't even think that I'm half way on any of the dials. I've had mine from virtually new and it's starting to lose pressure in the IFP now, I can tell by the climb dial is getting noticeably less. It's one of the best shocks I've used for the pop off pressure, I can hit the rough chunder on trails at high speeds and can't feel any spiking.

 

[the drizzle]

Given the regressive / progressive leverage ratio of the nomad. I'd be going with whichever of the shocks you can get to behave more linear. Then pair a matching fork... I only ran it with a coil so can't comment on air shocks. In saying that, @TheAzza runs a topaz and diamond on his and absolutely loves it.

 

[hellmansam]

Geez I dunno. Sounds like you need a new bike

 

[herbman]

My current thinking is to keep the Fox package on the Sam because the Float X2 works well with the faux bar setup. Although I'm thinking of switching the somewhat harsh rc2 damper to a Grip damper.

In my experience it’s not the damper that is the issue in the 36s but the air spring.

Was less than impressed with my 2017 RC2. It was harsh over the little stuff and I could barely hold on to the bars after a day at Maydena.

Had a go at setting it up with a Shox Wiz and it was better but still not great.

So I installed a vorbspung lulfkappe kit in the air spring and I am now super impressed with the fork with very little setup or playing around with the damping. Far better small bump and seems to set up in it travel better.

 

[Oddjob]

Thaks all for the replies.

It might need a service. I have plenty on range on my inline and I'm about 89kg kitted up ATM. I don't even think that I'm half way on any of the dials. I've had mine from virtually new and it's starting to lose pressure in the IFP now, I can tell by the climb dial is getting noticeably less. It's one of the best shocks I've used for the pop off pressure, I can hit the rough chunder on trails at high speeds and can't feel any spiking.

The ccdba has had 0 hours since service so I'm pretty that it's the shim stack and me being a lard ass.

I'm hoping that the Nomads high anti-squat will work well with ccdba as is. If it doesn't work out in the Nomad I will probably sell it.

Given the regressive / progressive leverage ratio of the nomad. I'd be going with whichever of the shocks you can get to behave more linear. Then pair a matching fork... I only ran it with a coil so can't comment on air shocks. In saying that, @TheAzza runs a topaz and diamond on his and absolutely loves it.

I've got the XV version of the ccdba, I've also got a Topaz so can try both.

In my experience it’s not the damper that is the issue in the 36s but the air spring.

Was less than impressed with my 2017 RC2. It was harsh over the little stuff and I could barely hold on to the bars after a day at Maydena.

Had a go at setting it up with a Shox Wiz and it was better but still not great.

So I installed a vorbspung lulfkappe kit in the air spring and I am now super impressed with the fork with very little setup or playing around with the damping. Far better small bump and seems to set up in it travel better.

Interesting. I've just installed the mrp ramp control in the Fox36 and this gives me dual air spring control, as well as the ramp control. I haven't spent a lot of time on the bike since so I will have to see if mucking around with the negative air spring helps.

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[Mywifesirrational]

The ccdba has had 0 hours since service so I'm pretty that it's the shim stack and me being a lard ass.

Lardarse?? I am 21kg heavier than you, what does that make me, I prefer lumberjack like!

Ran a CCDBA for 3 years on a V3 Nomad, currently run one on a Transition scout, and threw a my spare CCDB coil on the slayer for luls (wrong size / length, but i was curious). Never been an issue with getting enough rebound, going close to full results in rediculously slow rebound.

Maybe a focus has some wacky kinematics, but sounds like a dodgy shock to me.

 

[herbman]

Thaks all for the replies.



The ccdba has had 0 hours since service so I'm pretty that it's the shim stack and me being a lard ass.

I'm hoping that the Nomads high anti-squat will work well with ccdba as is. If it doesn't work out in the Nomad I will probably sell it.



I've got the XV version of the ccdba, I've also got a Topaz so can try both.



Interesting. I've just installed the mrp ramp control in the Fox36 and this gives me dual air spring control, as well as the ramp control. I haven't spent a lot of time on the bike since so I will have to see if mucking around with the negative air spring helps.

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What year is your 36? There were some issues with the 2015s when they came out. There is a good thread about it in the downhill part of Ridemonkey.

Also I would be going coil on the nomad. The poor mid stroke support of a air spring does not work well with the lack of support that VPP system on the nomad gives at the middle of its travel. I did not enjoy that feeling when grip was hard to find as the bike would blow through its travel when pushed hard into a turn then it felt like it would hit a wall and the rear tire would want to break traction.

 

[Oddjob]

Lardarse?? I am 21kg heavier than you, what does that make me, I prefer lumberjack like!

Ran a CCDBA for 3 years on a V3 Nomad, currently run one on a Transition scout, and threw a my spare CCDB coil on the slayer for luls (wrong size / length, but i was curious). Never been an issue with getting enough rebound, going close to full results in rediculously slow rebound.

Maybe a focus has some wacky kinematics, but sounds like a dodgy shock to me.

Are you sure? I'm currently sitting on 150kgs. I had 300psi in the ccdba when it was fitted. I had enough rebound, just. Ridiculously slow is the Topaz at full rebound.

I might get the ccdba checked out regardless.

What year is your 36? There were some issues with the 2015s when they came out. There is a good thread about it in the downhill part of Ridemonkey.

Also I would be going coil on the nomad. The poor mid stroke support of a air spring does not work well with the lack of support that VPP system on the nomad gives at the middle of its travel. I did not enjoy that feeling when grip was hard to find as the bike would blow through its travel when pushed hard into a turn then it felt like it would hit a wall and the rear tire would want to break traction.

Yep its a 2015. It's had multiple services and I've even swapped out the csu at one point, so I would be surprised if any issues hadn't been caught. I will check out the Ridemonkey thread though.

Hmm hadn't considered coil. I have a Dhx rc4 I could use. I would like to see if I could get the ccdba to work though, otherwise I'm going to sell it.

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[Mywifesirrational]

Are you sure? I'm currently sitting on 150kgs. I had 300psi in the ccdba when it was fitted. I had enough rebound, just. Ridiculously slow is the Topaz at full rebound.

I might get the ccdba checked out regardless. Yep its a 2015. It's had multiple services and I've even swapped out the csu at one point, so I would be surprised if any issues hadn't been caught. I will check out the Ridemonkey thread though.

Hmm hadn't considered coil. I have a Dhx rc4 I could use. I would like to see if I could get the ccdba to work though, otherwise I'm going to sell it.

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Ah, i thought I saw 90 odd kg written somewhere, in that case maybe the damping circuits need some custom tuning, especially if you going hard. I'd have a chat to NSD or someone who does custom tuning, they'd know what the best option for you is.

What is the max pressure for a CCDBA?

 

[the drizzle]

Hmm hadn't considered coil. I have a Dhx rc4 I could use.

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DHX rc4 is an absolute beast of a shock. I'd be riding that.

Although getting something like this sent straight to Craig @ avalanche for some love would be pretty epic.

FOX Van Performance Coil Shock 8.5" x 2.5" 216 x 63 Rebound LSC | eBay

Rebound adjust. 2016 FOX Van Performance Series Coil Shock. 2.5" stroke length.

rover.ebay.com

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[Flow-Rider]

Are you sure? I'm currently sitting on 150kgs. I had 300psi in the ccdba when it was fitted. I had enough rebound, just. Ridiculously slow is the Topaz at full rebound.

I think they max out at 250 psi, I've got mine at 240psi and still have a lot to go on the rebound.

 

[herbman]

Are you sure? I'm currently sitting on 150kgs. I had 300psi in the ccdba when it was fitted. I had enough rebound, just. Ridiculously slow is the Topaz at full rebound.

I might get the ccdba checked out regardless. Yep its a 2015. It's had multiple services and I've even swapped out the csu at one point, so I would be surprised if any issues hadn't been caught. I will check out the Ridemonkey thread though.

Hmm hadn't considered coil. I have a Dhx rc4 I could use. I would like to see if I could get the ccdba to work though, otherwise I'm going to sell it.

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The DHX RC4 would be my pick. One of the best options out there for a coil. Currently have on my patrol and had one on the reign I had before that.

 

[udi]

herbman is onto it.
Nomad3 has an awful leverage curve (heavily digressive first half of stroke = harsh then wallowy).

Best way to reduce ill effects is with a coil shock, ideally a smaller shaft one (so the 12.7mm small-shaft RC4 is preferable to the 15.875mm larger shaft). It still won't make it excellent, but it'll work far better in it than an air shock will. If I absolutely had to use an air shock in it it'd be a Float X2, but an RC4 - ideally the small-shaft version - would be the best option. If running the RC4, set it to maximum chamber volume and (then) minimum chamber pressure (usually 125psi, or as marked).