Food/Diet XC Nutrition

Bodin

GMBC
I've searched, but I can't find a really definitive thread on XC Nutrition. There are good threads that cover parts of the equation, but they're mainly about the training. I guess training and nutrition are inextricably linked as subjects, but I'd be interested in people's nutrition-specific contributions on FAQs like the following:

1. I'm not fit, but I'm about to do an endurance event for the fun of it and I want to know what to eat to avoid dying out on the track.

2. I'm fit, but I don't know why I'm not getting the most out of myself. I'm training well and doing all the right things (like stretching, etc...), but I just feel flat all the time.

I'm sure you get the idea. Please share your wisdom and experience and if there's already a really good thread on this, just point me to it and I'll link that in the FAQ thread instead.

Cheers.
 
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sidathensgold

Likes Dirt
For an endurance event, its important to carb load 3-4 days prior. This means increasing intake of carbo rich foods, especially pasta and bread and preferably low gi, however any carb is good carb. In conjunction with this, you should gradually taper off your riding during these days. Stick to 55%-65% max HR no longer than 45min. This enables the muscles to hold more muscle glycogen, and hence provide more energy for above 70% max HR.

Fats are important also, but the more so the good kind, such as avocado and olive oil, meat is good in moderation, but not fried food.

Your protein should remain relatively constant all the time but more so following training, take with carbohydrates, something like a banana smoothie with whey protein powder. This will ensure your muscles recover and improve condition following your tough miles.

In the morning of the race, a low Gi carb rich meal such as plenty of brown/multi bread with honey, porridge, museli, vita brits with milo. Make sure you've eaten this before because race day is not a day for new meals.

When riding, high Gi carbs like lollies or guu's are perfect for an energy boost, but for super long stuff ~6hrs moderate Gi such as museli bars could be taken also. 1 to 1.5 Litres of fluid should be consumed each hour. Sports drinks with salts prevent cramps (look for calcium and magnesium) and provide more effective hydration as fluid is retained unlike water.

After the race, down some lollies, keep up fluids and take in protein, all within 20mins of finishing, for optimum recovery. I like raspberries for carbs, and baked beans on grilled chees on toast is beautiful.......

What a mouthful, I find I understand it more if I write it all down, so this is helping me too! Hope this is useful...
 

Bodin

GMBC
Hope this is useful...
More than useful mate. Cheers.

When I did a 5 day race in the desert a few years ago, my diet was as follows:

Brekky - 4 to 6 weetbix with honey, milk powder and lots of water.
Morning Stage (80km) - 2 to 3 energy bars and 2 to 3 gels.
Lunch - 1 or 2 cans of creamed rice (vanilla being the favourite)
Afternoon Stage (50km) - 1 to 2 energy bars and 2 to 3 gels.
Dinner - Tuna Pasta or any other similar mix of Carbs and protein.

As far as hydration goes, the motto was "clear and copious" - the aim was always to be drinking enough to make sure your piss never dwindled to the dreaded little yellow drip/stream. If you let that happen, you were already dehydrated. For me, this meant drinking somewhere around 2 litres per hour, but everyone's different. This was about 4 times the average amount I'd been drinking on my roadie training rides over the winter and prepared me beautifully for a massive piss up at the end of the race.
 

ebuk

Likes Dirt
I'd add that in cold weather use water in your bottles that has been warmed and not "room temperature". Cold water in cold weather can make people drink a 500ml bottle over a lot longer period than is good for them.


For the first time I took a bottle of ENO (sponsors please send money to....) to WWS 1 at Lithgow. Gels have either given me no problems or REALLY bad stomach cramps, no matter how much I use them. At the 5 hour mark I stopped as stomach cramps had started, took in a glass of ENO (sponsors please send MORE money to....), burped up some Barney Gumble style gas and had no cramps at all for the next 4 hours.

In all the food prep I have done for races, I think this one has been my biggest discovery!
 
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DarrenHunt

Likes Dirt
More than useful mate. Cheers.

When I did a 5 day race in the desert a few years ago, my diet was as follows:

Brekky - 4 to 6 weetbix with honey, milk powder and lots of water.
Morning Stage (80km) - 2 to 3 energy bars and 2 to 3 gels.
Lunch - 1 or 2 cans of creamed rice (vanilla being the favourite)
Afternoon Stage (50km) - 1 to 2 energy bars and 2 to 3 gels.
Dinner - Tuna Pasta or any other similar mix of Carbs and protein.

As far as hydration goes, the motto was "clear and copious" - the aim was always to be drinking enough to make sure your piss never dwindled to the dreaded little yellow drip/stream. If you let that happen, you were already dehydrated. For me, this meant drinking somewhere around 2 litres per hour, but everyone's different. This was about 4 times the average amount I'd been drinking on my roadie training rides over the winter and prepared me beautifully for a massive piss up at the end of the race.
That seems bloody good.
Personally i can't stomach the creamed rice but there is nothing better.
 

dain2772

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I'd add that in cold weather use water in your bottles that has been warmed and not "room temperature". Cold water in cold weather can make people drink a 500ml bottle over a lot longer period than is good for them.


For the first time I took a bottle of ENO (sponsors please send money to....) to WWS 1 at Lithgow. Gels have either given me no problems or REALLY bad stomach cramps, no matter how much I use them. At the 5 hour mark I stopped as stomach cramps had started, took in a glass of ENO (sponsors please send MORE money to....), burped up some Barney Gumble style gas and had no cramps at all for the next 4 hours.

In all the food prep I have done for races, I think this one has been my biggest discovery!
Is that 'ENO' as in heart burn stuff?
 

Bodin

GMBC
That seems bloody good.
Personally i can't stomach the creamed rice but there is nothing better.
Yeah, I never used to eat much of it before then, but now I virtually live on the stuff - it's my play lunch every day and I get very Mr Cranky Pants if I go to the fridge and don't find any. :mad:

Something I like after races, especially in hot weather, are really cold, fresh oranges. The perfect mix of sweet and juicy when you're all hot and flustered after hours in the saddle. Always stick a few around the ice pack in the esky in the back of the ute in summer. They don't leave me feeling as sick as the obligatory CocaCola after a hard effort.

They don't mix well with beer though, so all you singlespeeders are going to have to avoid them. You nuts probably haven't heard of fruit anyway...;)
 

Dreggsy

Likes Bikes and Dirt

DarrenHunt

Likes Dirt
I found this site and for endurance racing the basis is 1g / kg of bodyweight / hour
I'm 70kg so I need 70gm of carbs per hour.

but I'm not sure if i should be looking at the

Available Carb per Serving
or
Carb Calories per Serving

http://web.mit.edu/athletics/sportsmedicine/wcrhighcarbs.html

I also found this one
http://www.time-to-run.com/nutrition/carbos.htm

has anybody got a better list for laymen to read?


any ideas

thanks in advance.

i'm guessing carbs per serve is how many grams of carbs and the carb calories is how many calories are obtained from the carbs.

the amound of calories you should intake in a race is damn near impossible.
take a 200km road ride i did a few weeks ago... burnt maybe 7000-8000 calories, even with a support car how on earth are you able to eat all those calories, the average joe would eat that over 4 days. i ended up taking in 2500, the most any of my mates got was 3500.

it shows that loading before an event is crucial. even then i think your body can only store a certain amount of carbs.

there was a very broad guideline on the ais site somewhere about xc and road riding nutrition... i'll try and dig it up.
 

DarrenHunt

Likes Dirt
the basic outline of my nutrition consists of:
- making sure you get enough calories
- variety - you need everything. small amounts of fat, enough sugar, even salt. i figured out a few weeks ago i need more salt.
- recovery food.. within a short period of time replenishing your fuel, a ratio 4:1 carbs to protein is the perfect ratio.

if i stop riding for one reason or another. ie. injury... slow down the intake.
 

Turner_rider

Likes Bikes and Dirt
After observing the nutritional activities of some past and present XC champions, I conclude that consumption of at least a six pack of full strength beer, a reasonable amount of fatty chips and maybe the odd fag (smoking variety) the night before a race is the secret to a winning performance. ;)
 

Coaster

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I conclude that consumption of at least a six pack of full strength beer, a reasonable amount of fatty chips and maybe the odd fag (smoking variety) the night before a race is the secret to a winning performance. ;)
You know, I'm willing to try the beer theory. And by god, I'll keep trying until I get it right! I don't care how long it takes........
 

akashra

Eats Squid
I raced Hard Day at the Office (Eildon) solo on the weekend just gone, and think I got the nutrition mostly right - only thing was that I forgot to take Magnesium tablets with me, which was costly. I pulled the pin after the 6 hour mark, mostly due to my knee, but also because my deltoids and triceps were just taking a hammering from riding a hardtail (well that was a pretty stupid thing to do while racing solo now wasn't it?). However I still felt like I had plenty of energy when I finished, not like Anglesea.

The 1g carps per kilo of body mass is pretty much spot on. Try to vary what you eat. Bananas are always good as they have a bit of potassium and sodium - I was basically sticking with Gu, Mueseli bars and Bananas, one every 25ish minutes. Laps were pretty much solid on 37 minutes (including the roughly 90 seconds I was stopping each lap at transition) for the first 4 hours, so what I'd do is any time a feed time came up at the transition point, it'd be banana; anywhere else on the track, Gu or bar. This particular track was really hard to find somewhere to eat - which is often a problem. Drinking wasn't nearly as hard as you could just do those long climbs with the bottle in your left hand.
Put some kind of mix in your drinks - I use three kinds of Gatorade, Staminade, and Gu, and just alternate between them on laps - that way you get some variety. These additives provide maybe 100kCal per bottle.

The main things that are important are to make sure you start eating before the race, and pay attention early on. Don't try to catch up on a missed snack. Keep drinking, and load up on Magnesium in the days/weeks before.

Be warned: There will come a point at which your body says "I'm not taking any more fooood!". For some people it's after 24 hours, others it happens to very early.

If you're smart, you can figure out which has the highest amount of calories per g or carbs. Of the stuff I was eating, the Fruit, Nut and Brownie AO bars had by far the highest kcal:non-sugar-carb ratio.
Be careful with nuts though - for some people they'll do exactly what asthma does - you'll have trouble breathing and your VO2 will just plummet unnaturally. I personally can't perform having eaten nuts of any kind.

Last, and most importantly: Don't try anything new during a race. Make sure you're good with everything you're going to be eating, and I don't just mean in general - make sure you can handle eating it while being in that E2 zone.
There's nothing worse than eating something in the first hour of an enduro which doesn't agree with you.
 
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DaGonz

Eats Squid
Put some kind of mix in your drinks - I use three kinds of Gatorade, Staminade, and Gu, and just alternate between them on laps - that way you get some variety. These additives provide maybe 100kCal per bottle.

<snip>

Be warned: There will come a point at which your body says "I'm not taking any more fooood!". For some people it's after 24 hours, others it happens to very early.
Mixing it up and having a variety I think is the key here. Also finding what foods will get you through a rough spot and what foods are a definate no go. Something a little savoury can be enough to get your taste buds back on to the carbs, though salami, anchovies and chili probably arn't good calls... Salt & vinegar chips can be a tasty treat when you've been sucking on sweet stuff all day

I find on Gu alone, I end up feeling empty so need something more substantial. Pieces of apple and bite sized bits of fruit bar in a wee plastic cup or zip lock bag seemed to do the trick in the past.

I've gone off bread sandwiches because I find them too starchy but relied on them as a staple when I was just starting out. On the flip side, Jason English pretty much just downs vegemite sandwhiches all day.

I found a bottle of diluted coke (30% mix...) at about the 4 or 5 hour mark has been good. It's either the small dash of caffine or simple sugars, I'm not sure, but I find it just perks my concentration up without giving me a sugar/caffine high.

Just some thoughts...

Cheers
Gonz
 

Dreggsy

Likes Bikes and Dirt
24hr

My recent efforts at the Scott 24hr

I did a nice and slow scout lap the day before looking at the track to find out the place where i could reach into my jersey pocket and pull out a Powerbar / Hammer gel or the likes.

A lap took approx 1h20min for the 25km. (i could be out a little here.)
but per lap (red and blue combined as 1 lap.) ,
I was drinking a 750ml bidon every lap
eating 1 powerbar per lap ,
2 hammer gels
this worked well until i started getting tired of all that sugary sweetness.....mmmmm...sugar
thats when I decided to get into the cold savoury pizza with a little cheese.....
the best food I had was at 12:30 which was a non creamy cup a soup.
full of salty goodness and MSG.


I get my stuff from Hammernutrition.com.au
this includes Hammer Gel, Heed and Perpeteum.

now its taken me 2hrs to write this post at work and have totally lost the point if i had one.
 

PDogg

Manly Warringah MTB Club
To follow on from Dreggsy and Spoony above, the longer the ride, the more varitey is your friend. During the Scott I ate all sorts of stuff. Standard was perhaps a Gu per lap, low strength sports drink or water depending on the palate at the time.

Solids for a 24 are essential I think. Gu and sprots drink are boring and leave you wanting 'real' food.

My three real foods that kept me ticking were all easy to handle and eat, and really tasty.

1. White chocolate mocha mini muffins (worth riding a lap for)
2. miniature arancini (italian rice ball) filled with beef bolognese (worth riding a lap for)
3. Slice of white bread with vegemite (thanks for the inspiration Mr English)

With these three plus a box of other assorted distractions (potato chips, bananas, honey, peanut butter, wagon wheels), the world is a happy happy place. Discalimer: at 9am on the Sunday i could hear the Coke in the tent calling me from the top of Stromlo. Oh, I love you Black Doctor).

For 4 hour or 100km races you can rock out on Gu's and maybe a power bar or two. For more than 5 hours get into the solids kiddies.

Hmm, time for lunch. I'm hungry.
 

PLUCAS

Likes Dirt
I have noticed recently that Brown Rice lifts my energy thru the roof
On our usual training ride I am normally mid pack but a Few times by
accident and a few times now on purpose as experiment I have eaten
Brown Rice before said ride and somehow I find myself out in front.
I would think for an endurance race Brown (forget white anything you might
as well eat cardboard) Rice would be an excellent energy source as it can
be eaten hot or cold and mixed with whatever.
For the eight hour Dh I made a huge Fried BROWN rice and ate that all
day except it was not much of a test because of timing malfunctions we
only got 6 runs in. though I did get up at 4am drove there and back
didn't get home till nine and I felt tops.
Try it out for youself and I would like to see if anyone else finds the same
n.b It does take about two and half times longer to cook than white
rice but tastes much better.
 

krisko

Likes Dirt
Also what works for one race may not work for the next, as I discovered at Lithgows 8hr.

I don't bother with ratios of carbs per kilo of body weight hell every lap I would be on the laptop working out something that may be nothing more than a theory that works for most people but you!

My favourites are Two fruits in syrup eaten with some moist banana bread every lap with 1/3 Cherry ripe mid lap for long events. Gus etc can taste too chemical and bitey after a few hours. Real food is the go.

Corn chips gave me a boost at the last 8hr and I finally discovered how well flat coke goes down and carbs you up! In between laps.

My problem is long lap stops to eat that add up on solo 8hr events.

Also keeping cool works well to increase speed, so spraying a mist of water on your face neck can get rid of that nasty salty stuff and get you into your next lap fresh.

My 2 cents
 
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