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Thread: Transition Bikes Introduces Speed Balanced Geometry - SBG

  1. #11
    Supersports xero's Avatar
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    The focus here is not just offset.
    There has been a fairly standard adaption over the last few years going from 26, 27.5 and 29 in relation to trail.
    Yet, over the last few years, our bikes have changed dramatically.
    ( Anyone still running 71 degree head angles, 90mm stems and 680 bars? .... Ok maybe a few! )

    Lars puts it best here:
    "In the last 5 years, your mountain bike has changed in in many ways.
    Your wheels have likely gotten bigger. Your frame has gotten longer.
    Your head tube has gotten slacker. Your suspension has improved.
    Your stem has gotten shorter and your bars have gotten wider.
    And you likely have a remote dropper seat post opposed to a straight post.
    Your components have improved in ways that have allowed you to ride easier, farther and harder.
    Yet, the there are some things that haven't been updated with the rest of these improvements.
    One of these things is steering trail.
    Trail is one of the dimensions that relates to particular steering feel and handling characteristics.
    Current trail figures fall between a regular set of parameters depending on wheel size and bike suspension travel.
    The thing is, this range of trail is based on an old legacy of 26" bikes with outdated geometry;
    steep head tube angles, shorter reach and top tube, longer stems and skinnier handlebars.

    Why shouldn't this evolve with the rest of your bike?"

  2. #12
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    I see that Specialized have also "taken a bold step and created its own custom fork offset" with the new epic .... 42mm.

    From bike exchange presser:

    "6. Custom Fork Offset

    With the head angle slackening out and the reach growing, Specialized has taken a bold step and created its own custom fork offset. Interestingly, this arguably goes in the opposite direction of most 29ers, with less offset being chosen.

    As a result, the new Epic features a fork with 42mm offset, something creates a higher trail number (94mm). Thatís 10mm more than the previous Epic. On paper, this should give the bike an impressive straight-line stability but may come at the cost of agility. Itís something weíre eager to test out ourselves. "

  3. #13
    Senior Member Knuckles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by creaky View Post
    I see that Specialized have also "taken a bold step and created its own custom fork offset" with the new epic .... 42mm.

    From bike exchange presser:

    "6. Custom Fork Offset

    With the head angle slackening out and the reach growing, Specialized has taken a bold step and created its own custom fork offset. Interestingly, this arguably goes in the opposite direction of most 29ers, with less offset being chosen.

    As a result, the new Epic features a fork with 42mm offset, something creates a higher trail number (94mm). Thatís 10mm more than the previous Epic. On paper, this should give the bike an impressive straight-line stability but may come at the cost of agility. Itís something weíre eager to test out ourselves. "
    I believe they're planning to patent it before Transition take it to market.....surprisingly, boldly.

    The buzz is they'll be calling it Specialized Human Intergrated Technology.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knuckles View Post
    I believe they're planning to patent it before Transition take it to market.....surprisingly, boldly.

    The buzz is they'll be calling it Specialized Human Intergrated Technology.
    Shit hey ?

    It's just not cool once specialized does it.

    The new transition looks sweet though.

  5. #15
    Supersports xero's Avatar
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    The big S doing it on shorter travel bikes is cool.... Be interesting to see if they carry across the line of the longer models.
    Transition believes this train of thought will become more common.
    Last edited by xero; 04-07-2017 at 11:35 AM.

  6. #16
    Clinically Inane
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knuckles View Post
    I believe they're planning to patent it before Transition take it to market.....surprisingly, boldly.

    The buzz is they'll be calling it Specialized Human Intergrated Technology.
    That doesn't sound like Specialized at all...

    Stratos forks anyone?

  7. #17
    Vealcake
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    Quote Originally Posted by pink poodle View Post

    Stratos forks anyone?
    Yes please

  8. #18
    Senior Member Flow-Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xero View Post
    The focus here is not just offset.
    There has been a fairly standard adaption over the last few years going from 26, 27.5 and 29 in relation to trail.
    Yet, over the last few years, our bikes have changed dramatically.
    ( Anyone still running 71 degree head angles, 90mm stems and 680 bars? .... Ok maybe a few! )

    Lars puts it best here:
    "In the last 5 years, your mountain bike has changed in in many ways.
    Your wheels have likely gotten bigger. Your frame has gotten longer.
    Your head tube has gotten slacker. Your suspension has improved.
    Your stem has gotten shorter and your bars have gotten wider.
    And you likely have a remote dropper seat post opposed to a straight post.
    Your components have improved in ways that have allowed you to ride easier, farther and harder.
    Yet, the there are some things that haven't been updated with the rest of these improvements.
    One of these things is steering trail.
    Trail is one of the dimensions that relates to particular steering feel and handling characteristics.
    Current trail figures fall between a regular set of parameters depending on wheel size and bike suspension travel.
    The thing is, this range of trail is based on an old legacy of 26" bikes with outdated geometry;
    steep head tube angles, shorter reach and top tube, longer stems and skinnier handlebars.

    Why shouldn't this evolve with the rest of your bike?"
    Why don't you see if anyone is willing to make lower fork legs with adjustable trail by different replaceable dropouts lengths or some sort of system with a pivot clamp and shims. We've been doing it on race cars for what seems like eons.

    If trail is a critical component of the frame design it will change with different height forks or even different sag settings that people use.
    "To avoid criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing." ~Aristotle.

  9. #19
    Senior Member dunndog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flow-Rider View Post

    If trail is a critical component of the frame design it will change with different height forks or even different sag settings that people use.
    No more than wheelbase or rake, but these things are set measurements..
    I won't beat you to the punch, i'll punch you to the beat - Hilltop Hoods

  10. #20
    Senior Member Flow-Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunndog View Post
    No more than wheelbase or rake, but these things are set measurements..
    Yes, the static dimensions are all relative to themselves on the front as in you change 1 and it alters the other, unless you modify other parts of the frame to be adjustable.

    20mm either side of the wheelbase will most likely be unnoticeable but 20mm either side of 40mm of trail will do a lot with the feel and handling of the bike as you're severely altering the caster angle.

    We have adjustable headsets, adjustable chips for rear pivots and why not have adjustable fork trail?

    You can still use the same forks on other models of bikes without changing the complete fork legs over.
    Last edited by Flow-Rider; 08-07-2017 at 10:43 AM.
    "To avoid criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing." ~Aristotle.

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