Working at the Mines (unskilled and skilled jobs)

[Waldo]

Crazy photo of conditions at Mt Isa

Luckily however this side of the world (ie NOT South Africa), temperatures aren't that extreme. Mt Isa (I assume its a Mt Isa mine?) is one of the few mines in Australia that are so hot that it requires the air to pass through a giant regrigerator prior to being sent underground.

I'll add my thoughts to this thread properly when I get time maybe later in the week. Like alot of these guys I'm a professional in the industry, but we've seen enough unskilled workers come into the fold.

Ps. I like throwing bolts for a jumbo - I'd love a job that doesn't require a high level of thought every day (note that just because it doesn't require thinking doesn't mean you can totally switch off. Its quite a dangerous job too I'd argue).

 

[Hamsta]

Have you considered working offshore? Money is average, depending upon your role and level of competency/training/experience. One big advantage imo is that if you pay attention, you can vicariously learn some of the roles/responsibilities of the higher paying specialist jobs as every one is working pretty closely and sharing information regarding different stages in the operation. Some experienced specialist techs pull close to $250k + benefits/bonuses and are not engineers/graduates. They pretty much follow work from rig to rig. Downside is many are on a rather random roster e: away from home alot. You need to be prepared to undertake paid training in your time off, and be on-call 25/7 366 days a year. Be prepared to work sometimes very very odd hours and manage your sleep/wellbeing. If you develop a good professional relationship with a client/rig then you will always have work. If you are organised, you will have plenty of time for studying/gym/movies/internet/eating/PS3/talking shit/reading books. Excellent environment to save $ as everything is paid for between the time the taxi arrives and leaves the house.

Rig crews tend to have more set rosters which is a benefit but they earn their money, especially when working in high humidity/heat.
For example, if you don't mind unskilled work, a Roustabout on the rig I work on earns about 130K+ bonuses and uber corporate health cover (this would be worth $4k+ p.y) for spouse and dependents, 3 weeks on/3 weeks off, double time for any additional days. I've met many Client Reps (Company Men) who started as Roustabouts 25+ years ago and now walk away with $80-90K gross for a 28 day hitch offshore

In saying all this, rates of pay are not what they used to be for many roles, and if you want to bank the 'Hollywood $' then perhaps look at obtaining a 'niche' formal post grad qualification that appeals to you if you enjoy the working environment and plan to make a career in the industry. If you are prepared to work/learn and are efficient there are opportunities for advancement up through the ranks and, as with any other vocation, more responsibility = more $$$

 

[Hobzai]

+1 for Hamsta's post.

Less flies, less dust and if you're talking about WA's North West, it's usually cooler out on the Shelf as well. Conversely you could find yourself needle gunning handrails in 40 knots and hailstones like some of the poor bastards on the rig I'm on right now.

If you don't want to start as a roustie or roughneck, you could look into a mech/hydraulics TAFE cert and try and get into a service company like Halliburton, Cameron, Schlumberger, Weatherfords et al. It's shit money to start with and they treat you like a piece of equipment but it does get you into the game. Service companies generally train you up real nice, but very specifically to their equipment.

Then, with a lot of experience and knowledge, you can go work for an operator (the "client") which is where the proper money is. The night client rep on this thing I'm currently on is an ex-Cameron guy from way back.

If you're clever and pick things up fast, you can go far but it takes time, hard work and good networking (or sometimes flat out shameless nepotism).

 

[MasterOfReality]

MOR will understand this, but suffice to say its HOT, and that is the sort of conditions you'll find yourself in:

Holy shit, where was that? Bottom of decline, blind heading?

When I was vent engineer, the worst I recorded was 38 dry bulb, 36 wet bulb in a blind heading. And all the readings were done with a vane anemometer and whirling hygrometer. Humid but not quite as humid as what you have there.

Nothing like jumping out of the Landcruiser and having your glasses fog up instantly

 

[Arete]

FWIW my 0.5c...

I've got far less experience working for mines than the other guys posting here.

But I've done a few contracts as sort of a consultant to the consultants on environmental jobs. These are insanely lucrative - My daily rate is as much as I earn in a month working my usual job. I did a contract for a big uranium company and got the job done under budget and ahead of deadline - and since get offered more mine work than I can possibly do - if I so wanted I could easily live on 3 months of work out there a year.

However, I've had issues with smaller consultancies who have obviously played the margins and lost - needing a person like me in to help. Got offered less than minimum wage after having to get myself to a remote fifo site by one mob who got nasty when I told them no way (they ended up having to hand the contract back). They're also hard work - I can only bill 12 hour days, but my standard day would have me start clearing traps at 5am and finish spotlighting at 10.30pm. Socially speaking, the sites have been in the main, outwardly hostile places to be. I usually grab food and get out of the mess as fast as I can before someone can launch into their "greenies like you are ruining my industry" tirade. There are exceptions and I've met a few awesome old "salt of the earth" types who want to chat about birds/lizards/plants etc.

I was told on my last job by one of the mine managers that the days of six figure salaries for unskilled, inexperienced workers were over - but due to the amount of overtime available there is still money to be made.

 

[wombat]

pic snip

Ergh! That's a bloody sauna.

What are the other readings though? I'm guessing WS is wind speed, but what's TWL? Something to do with energy absorbtion or loss?

 

[sxereturn]

FWIW my 0.5c...

I've got far less experience working for mines than the other guys posting here.

But I've done a few contracts as sort of a consultant to the consultants on environmental jobs. These are insanely lucrative - My daily rate is as much as I earn in a month working my usual job. I did a contract for a big uranium company and got the job done under budget and ahead of deadline - and since get offered more mine work than I can possibly do - if I so wanted I could easily live on 3 months of work out there a year.

However, I've had issues with smaller consultancies who have obviously played the margins and lost - needing a person like me in to help. Got offered less than minimum wage after having to get myself to a remote fifo site by one mob who got nasty when I told them no way (they ended up having to hand the contract back). They're also hard work - I can only bill 12 hour days, but my standard day would have me start clearing traps at 5am and finish spotlighting at 10.30pm. Socially speaking, the sites have been in the main, outwardly hostile places to be. I usually grab food and get out of the mess as fast as I can before someone can launch into their "greenies like you are ruining my industry" tirade. There are exceptions and I've met a few awesome old "salt of the earth" types who want to chat about birds/lizards/plants etc.

I was told on my last job by one of the mine managers that the days of six figure salaries for unskilled, inexperienced workers were over - but due to the amount of overtime available there is still money to be made.

A mate of mine is currently breaking free from a large scale consultancy and together we are bidding for a few field projects. If you have any offers that you can't fulfill, feel free to send them this way

It is absolutely ridiculous the sort of money that can be made in field consultancy. I had a friend who was charging himself out at $270/hr, 12 hour days. Absolutely nuts.

 

[MasterOfReality]

A mate of mine is currently breaking free from a large scale consultancy and together we are bidding for a few field projects. If you have any offers that you can't fulfill, feel free to send them this way

It is absolutely ridiculous the sort of money that can be made in field consultancy. I had a friend who was charging himself out at $270/hr, 12 hour days. Absolutely nuts.

Thats quite close to my hourly rate.

The only difference is I don't work for myself

But in around 10 years I plan to

 

[MasterOfReality]

If I remember correctly, TWL = Thermal Work Limits.

There are different threshold levels that dictate what action should be taken, but the reading on that instrument suggests 'get the fark out of there'.

 

[Rider_of_Fast]

Sheesh, I clearly chose the wrong career path doing business/finance. However, not all is wasted, I don't believe any edu is a waste if you put your 100% into it, do well and put it into practice, which I have done.

But I mean its so hard trying to figure out what you want to do when you just finish school barely as a 17yo (wow thats 5 years ago!). Clearly others are better decision makers than I am and maybe its a sign of immaturity and poor foresight. I guess I am just afraid of the opportunity cost of one profession over another and spending my latter life kicking myself that I didnt do something else when I was younger. Hence my attitude to going out to the mines to get some life/work experience 'of a different kind' before making the big decision and committing to a lifelong career.

But then again, hearing all your stories is making me think it may be a better idea to go back to uni and commence a different career path asap before wasting precious time in youth. I guess once you gain the qualifications as a skilled professional, you never look back.

To those with tertiary edu behind you, can any of you guys look back in hindsight and remember where you were at prior to becoming professionals in your field? I mean, before you embarked on your studies. Was it always such a well defined path that you immediately knew your destiny? Sorry to get all philosophical on you, but it definately seems like I am talking to the right crowd!

Decisions decisions.

 

[top_dog]

Luckily however this side of the world (ie NOT South Africa), temperatures aren't that extreme. Mt Isa (I assume its a Mt Isa mine?) is one of the few mines in Australia that are so hot that it requires the air to pass through a giant regrigerator prior to being sent underground.

Ps. I like throwing bolts for a jumbo - I'd love a job that doesn't require a high level of thought every day (note that just because it doesn't require thinking doesn't mean you can totally switch off. Its quite a dangerous job too I'd argue).

Not Mt Isa but nearby. We will have a refrigeration pant eventually but its not in yet obviously.

Holy shit, where was that? Bottom of decline, blind heading?

Yeah bottom of the decline, where men were working. Pretty nuts. Thats what you get when you try to ventilate through 1600m of 20m lengths vent bag. Friction loss!

Ergh! That's a bloody sauna.

What are the other readings though? I'm guessing WS is wind speed, but what's TWL? Something to do with energy absorbtion or loss?

If I remember correctly, TWL = Thermal Work Limits.

There are different threshold levels that dictate what action should be taken, but the reading on that instrument suggests 'get the fark out of there'.

Correct. From memory its meant to be over 115 to work in the area. The units are watts per m^2 or something. How much heat the body can dissipate through the skin basically. If its really humid the sweat cannot evaporate and you end up with sick men very quickly.

To those with tertiary edu behind you, can any of you guys look back in hindsight and remember where you were at prior to becoming professionals in your field? I mean, before you embarked on your studies. Was it always such a well defined path that you immediately knew your destiny? Sorry to get all philosophical on you, but it definately seems like I am talking to the right crowd!

Decisions decisions.

I've always wanted to be a mining engineer, straight from school. I thought it was a good combination of mech/civil/elec/geo/management and it is really.

 

[Ivan]

To those with tertiary edu behind you, can any of you guys look back in hindsight and remember where you were at prior to becoming professionals in your field? I mean, before you embarked on your studies. Was it always such a well defined path that you immediately knew your destiny? Sorry to get all philosophical on you, but it definately seems like I am talking to the right crowd!

Decisions decisions.

No, I'm still not on the right path, and I'm still studying postgrad.


Going back to Uni and starting over is a very expensive and time consuming way of doing things. If I had my time over again, I would try and get myself into one of the many internships/cadetships on offer where you gain valuable experience while you study, are paid, and your Uni expenses are covered by the company.

 

[MasterOfReality]

To those with tertiary edu behind you, can any of you guys look back in hindsight and remember where you were at prior to becoming professionals in your field? I mean, before you embarked on your studies. Was it always such a well defined path that you immediately knew your destiny? Sorry to get all philosophical on you, but it definately seems like I am talking to the right crowd!

Decisions decisions.

No, it was not a well defined path for me. I always wanted to be a mechanic. My parents wanted me to be a professional. I loved building stuff and pulling shit apart to see how it works etc etc.

I was undecided until Yr 11 when the uni sent a few professors to the school to give a presentation about engineering. They presented average salaries and I remember sitting there thinking 'fark, that sounds alright'.

Went home and over the following months did research about engineering, job prospects, salaries etc etc. My natural choice was mechanical engineering. I quickly found out that the starting salaries weren't great and the numbers of grads huge. My old man then said why don't I consider mining engineering, as my grandfather was a mining engineer and mine manager in Germany and did very well financially out of it.

So I looked around and the local uni taught mining engineering, the starting salaries were quite good, so that settled it.

 

[Adrian]

Rider_of_fast, These big mines need someone to count their beans and make business decisions too . Mid to long-term, you may be in a better position in the resources industry than you think, and you're not limited to a particular industry. I think I would have done business and finance if I could have afforded to.

And in terms of finding work for your partner, the right company with the right attitude to your work conditions will help you with that in my opinion. Have seen it happen successfully on a number of occasions.

I studied a BE in Surveying. Could have stayed in Sydney or gone back home to rural NSW for a pittance starting salary, or seen somewhere new and experienced a different work path for double the money in QLD so the decision was easy. Four years later I'm still here.

 

[MasterOfReality]

^^ True

My fiance is a financial accountant for one of the biggest mining companies out there. She looks after coal sales for their Bowen Basin mines.

Did a bachelor of business (I think) and her cpa.

She is 27 and earns 6 figures.

Very good for office based work in my opinion.

 

[wazzaa]

i work in the pilbara for rio as a graduate engineer.

to get in as an unskilled operator, your best be is some form of recruitment company who will hire you as a contractor. if you get the gig and they like you, they may take you on board as staff. virtually no-one i have heard of gets a job on staff without prior experience.

the job itself is pretty full on... i do 9 on 5 off. be prepared for a fairly massive lifestyle sacrifice... i dont get to ride anywhere near as much as i want.. it sucks ass

 

[Hobzai]

To those with tertiary edu behind you, can any of you guys look back in hindsight and remember where you were at prior to becoming professionals in your field? I mean, before you embarked on your studies. Was it always such a well defined path that you immediately knew your destiny? Sorry to get all philosophical on you, but it definately seems like I am talking to the right crowd!
Decisions decisions.

I was one of those kids that was always taking old radios and TVs to pieces or fixing my mates stereos. I did Electronics Engineering but unfortunately I burnt out big time during uni and ended up taking far too long to get my degree. After that I'd had enough of Engineering and Engineers so I did a completely unrelated manufacturing operations management job for less than average wage for about five years too long before getting back into Engineering, working offshore. I actually got my start on the recommendation of someone of good standing already doing it (remember - nepotism!).

My path was never well defined in fact I didn't even like it for a long time but that's delving into parental issues and a whole other can of worms.

But now, with experience and my degree behind me, I'm looking to get into Subsea Engineering OR Process Operations. A nice FPSO gig with a Norwegian roster would suit me perfectly in my mid-40's.

 

[muskimo]

ive been busting my ass to get into/onto the mines for a couple years now, was looking into overseas mines as well, through MMG etc, ive been in the construction circuit for many years now, and am multi qualified, though like others have said, it seams as if you have not worked in a mine before they dont want to know you, even if the area is extremely short handed.

if anyone does have a way in for me, or could get me in, feel free to contact me and have a chat.

 

[pistonbroke]

I also have thought about going west or maybe north. But what has put me off is property prices/rental prices.
In a small dustbowl of a town in WA near a mine you will pay around $750,000 for a crappy 2 bedroom house. I mean a real shit hole. A nicer 3 or four bedroom place will be $1.25M+.
Just rent, I hear you say. That same 2 bedroom shit hole will set you back $1500 a week.

So how much can you earn to make it worthwhile?

 

[muskimo]

there are some sites that are on site living so to speak.

my mate lives on his site, still gets driven its a good 20mins though its paid accommodation, for those that drink discounted alcohol, gym (i would be in heaven, love the gym) and does 3on 1off, gets flown back to perth for his break.