Lockring issues on Hope Pro 2 EVO?

[Warp]

Hi, All!!

I was doing a race last Sunday where the rear end of the bike rattled like crazy, the drivetrain would refuse to shift from 3rd to 4th cog either up or down and it was a nightmare but it was holding up.

After the race, I noticed that the lockring and cassette were loose on the freehub.

I checked today and there is no major damage, the lockring and freehub threads appear to be fine, the smaller cogs did chew a little bit on the freehub but no filing or fighting was necessary to remove the cogs or put them back in.

Now, upon reassembly, I noticed that the two 3-cog carriers fit loose on the hub. The splines look OK in there, but you can rock the cogs fore-aft when the lockring is loose. WTF?

That takes me to the real issue. I can't seem to tighten the lockring as much as on other hubs I have had. I would tighten and then if I keep tightening, it would come loose again. Threads look ok, though. Crazy. I would expect the threads on the lockring or freehub to be damaged but it doesn't look that is the case.

This cassette was working like a charm on my Hadley... I need to ride it again to discard that I left the lockring too loose but I am wondering if I am missing something.



What am I missing???
It just seems too weird that the lockring would tighten up and then come loose if you keep tightening it without damaging the threads either on the lockring or freehub?


Anybody has had these issues with Shimano XT CS-M771 cassettes on Hope Pro II EVO hubs?
Again, the cassette did fit tight on the Hadley.

What is a better lockring replacement? Something with deeper threads and/or steel?


Thanks!

 

[moorey]

4 sets of pro 2 Evo, all running XT m771 cassettes, have been for ages. Never had the problem, sorry. :noidea:

 

[moorey]

You can buy steel cassettes barrels, but I personally wouldn't go through the aus distro if looking for one.

 

[ChopSticks]

i know youve mentioned it
but given the cassette is working fine on the hadley.. the only thing I can think of is the threads on the freehub itself has been damaged

try screwing the lockring onto the freehub without a cassette and try to simply pull it off. ... if it comes off... then theres your problem (might need to replace BOTH as damaged threads would ruin your new part... safer just to replace both.)

 

[Warp]

i know youve mentioned it
but given the cassette is working fine on the hadley.. the only thing I can think of is the threads on the freehub itself has been damaged

try screwing the lockring onto the freehub without a cassette and try to simply pull it off. ... if it comes off... then theres your problem (might need to replace BOTH as damaged threads would ruin your new part... safer just to replace both.)

I tried with a 12t lockring from a Tiagra-level cassette and it would tighten up nicely. I will try with a lockring from a Deore level cassette I have around too, just for sh*ts and giggles.

But I will try what you say. It makes sense. When a threaded part comes loose after certain torque, something already gave up. I was fearing it was the freehub as it is a rather expensive fix but hey, you live you learn not to overtighten/undertighten stuff.


What about fore-aft play on the carrier-mounted cogs? Something to worry about? They did fit a little tighter on the Hadleys. God, I already miss the Titanium freehubs on my last two wheelsets! (Hadley, Hope Bulb)


Thanks, guys!

 

[madstace]

I had this issue with my non-EVO Pro 2. The rattle was rather annoying but didn't seem to affect shifting too much. When I was selling my wheelset with this hub to blacksp20, I checked it with a new spare cassette and there was some slight play, but not as much as with a used cassette. My guess was that the chewing of the splines must also wear the carrier a bit, worsening the problem. The bite marks also seem to prevent the cassette sitting flush, so no matter how tight you get the lockring, there will always be movement. blacksp20 is getting around the issue by going to a steel freehub as part of his EVO conversion. If he'd been staying with the existing freehub, I would have got the file out to see if I could fix it.

I don't get why hub manufacturers don't borrow Novatec's anti bite guard idea, but make ALL the splines steel. If the carrier itself was still alloy, I can't see there being much of a weight penalty.

 

[ChopSticks]

I tried with a 12t lockring from a Tiagra-level cassette and it would tighten up nicely. I will try with a lockring from a Deore level cassette I have around too, just for sh*ts and giggles.

But I will try what you say. It makes sense. When a threaded part comes loose after certain torque, something already gave up. I was fearing it was the freehub as it is a rather expensive fix but hey, you live you learn not to overtighten/undertighten stuff.


What about fore-aft play on the carrier-mounted cogs? Something to worry about? They did fit a little tighter on the Hadleys. God, I already miss the Titanium freehubs on my last two wheelsets! (Hadley, Hope Bulb)


Thanks, guys!

if you have all those cassettes lying around.. .cant you just used a lockring from one of them to tighten your XT cassette?

abit of play is expected, but hard to tell if what you have is excessive. (I run single piece cassette so dont have that problem :first

not sure how freaking tight you went... 40n.m is the highest toruqe setting on the bike (i can think of) and thats ALOT of force! for you to exceed that... then you really should check your other bolts too!

if there another wheel (evo hub) you can try on?

 

[moorey]

I don't get why hub manufacturers don't borrow Novatec's anti bite guard idea, but make ALL the splines steel. If the carrier itself was still alloy, I can't see there being much of a weight penalty.

You just don't understand the weight weenie thing, do you? :tsk:

I would also also love the steel cassette barrels on the hopes, but I'm not paying a fortune to swap them over :hand:

 

[Warp]

if you have all those cassettes lying around.. .cant you just used a lockring from one of them to tighten your XT cassette?

abit of play is expected, but hard to tell if what you have is excessive. (I run single piece cassette so dont have that problem :first

not sure how freaking tight you went... 40n.m is the highest toruqe setting on the bike (i can think of) and thats ALOT of force! for you to exceed that... then you really should check your other bolts too!

if there another wheel (evo hub) you can try on?

I don't think I went medieval on that thing at all but I am assuming user error until I can prove otherwise.
No, I don't have any other Pro 2's around... and I just sold my Hadley hubs! :grumpy:

I would also also love the steel cassette barrels on the hopes, but I'm not paying a fortune to swap them over :hand:

This may be a good chance for me to swap over, unfortunately. Titanium is the shizzle there.

 

[moorey]

If you contact hope uk, (who are awesomely helpful), they will tell you that hope aus distro will sell you one (steel). But they won't. They will only sell whole freehub. Let me know how you go. I had no luck.

 

[Warp]

If you contact hope uk, (who are awesomely helpful), they will tell you that hope aus distro will sell you one (steel). But they won't. They will only sell whole freehub. Let me know how you go. I had no luck.

Seems too much of a hassle when I can get it from CRC. I don't think I have grounds for a Warranty issue... yet.

 

[moorey]

Seems too much of a hassle when I can get it from CRC. I don't think I have grounds for a Warranty issue... yet.

I meant to buy. Crc didn't have steel cassette bodies when I looked last. I didn't want to buy whole hub body, just the shell that the cassette mounts on.

 

[Warp]

I meant to buy. Crc didn't have steel cassette bodies when I looked last. I didn't want to buy whole hub body, just the shell that the cassette mounts on.

Then dismiss my last post, bro.

CRC has complete freehubs in steel, at the moment. Will do for me if I go that way. To much of a hassle to replace the bearing(s) in that thing, in my case.

 

[moorey]

No worries. Good luck with it.

 

[blacksp20]

A steel freehub with bearings can be had for ~$100 including bearings and spacers I believe. Same price as the alloy part.

As Madstace said, I've ordered a steel one with upgraded bearings and axle to spec a Pro 2 to EVO.

 

[creaky]

I don't get why hub manufacturers don't borrow Novatec's anti bite guard idea, but make ALL the splines steel. If the carrier itself was still alloy, I can't see there being much of a weight penalty.

I believe Novatec 'borrowed' that idea from American classic who did it in a light way with steel strips along the edge of one or two (can't remember) splines.

 

[Gripo]

All though I've never had this issue on any Hope P2 hub or converted to Evo hub.....

I have had similar issues with a Mavic hub.....it required a "spacer" that went on before the cassette to take up the "slack"....it was a couple MM thickness...

 

[Alo661]

Wish companies just made steel freehub bodies (Mavic does). Saving weight on a load-bearing part like this is pretty pointless, unless you want to keep making money off freehub bodies!

All though I've never had this issue on any Hope P2 hub or converted to Evo hub.....

I have had similar issues with a Mavic hub.....it required a "spacer" that went on before the cassette to take up the "slack"....it was a couple MM thickness...

All road and some lower end Mavic freehubs (early Crossrides for example) have that. All Mavic's road wheels were 11 speed compatible before 11 speed even existed.

 

[blacksp20]

Wish companies just made steel freehub bodies (Mavic does). Saving weight on a load-bearing part like this is pretty pointless, unless you want to keep making money off freehub bodies!

Hope do. It's exactly the same price as the alloy one. I wish they'd offer it as a standard option when you buy a hub or wheel though.

 

[silentbutdeadly]

Wish companies just made steel freehub bodies (Mavic does). Saving weight on a load-bearing part like this is pretty pointless, unless you want to keep making money off freehub bodies!

White Industries does....you can have them in titanium too. Only a 38 gram weight penalty over the Hope Pro2 Evo for the steel. Granted that they aren't the cheapest (WI Mi6 rear hub is ~US$300 for the steel and ~US$340 for titanium) but they certainly last the best part of forever.

I do note that the Hope website makes no mention these days of a steel freehub or cassette barrel for the Pro2 or Pro2 Evo hub...nor for, that matter, the option of straight pull spokes. Methinks the remaining stock at CRC et al. may be the last of their race.

On the other hand...I like the look of their new crankset and dropper seatpost clamp