Roadie vs MTB riding position

[Nerf Herder]

I have been commuting to work on a roadie as opposed to a HT MTB of late and this is what I am noticing.

Disclaimer: All of this is perceived as opposed to scientifically measured (via stop watch, HRM etc etc), so take it easy.

- My speeds (top speed and cruising speed) seem faster ... but my overall time is roughly the same if not marginally slower ??? (My computer isn't fully operational yet so more science later)

- I think I'm taking the hills faster ... but the corners and down hill bits slower. I accelerate faster by brake or back off earlier. so my roadie bike handling sux balls.

- Lastly, at the end of the ride I feel overly fatigued ... especially in the legs.

Now, my stem is a little too long ... but everything else seems right (I don't have full leg extension, but the knees aren't overly bent ... I think its very similar to my XC leg extension).

Soooo ... "whats the question ?" you ask.

Why am I feeling so tried at the end ???

I think my fitness is about the same as previous (ie, when riding the MTB). I've been feeling really good on the weekly XC night ride ... I've even convinced myself that I'm a little fitter ... my diet is about the same ... so its down to the bike and ride position.

I figured it may be due to bike setup (my stem is prolly 20 to 30 mm too long, but I've been compensating by resting on the top bar as opposed to the hoods). I would see this accounting for my slower times, even if my speeds are higher ... but it wouldn't add to my fatigue would it ??

If the setup was dialed I suspect that my the riding position would still be different enough that I'm actually using different muscles (or parts of muscles) ... I'm guessing this is why I'm shagged.

So is my logic sound, and ride position is different enough that I still have to get used to it (I haven't ridden roadies for about 20 years, and its only my second day of commuting) or am I just a fat bastard and I'm not as fit as I think I am ... which would explain why my times are about the same ... even if I suspect its more about bike handling ?

anywho ... appreciate the comments.

 

[mushroom]

- My speeds (top speed and cruising speed) seem faster ... but my overall time is roughly the same if not marginally slower ??? (My computer isn't fully operational yet so more science later)

Are there many traffic lights on your route?

Your extra top speed and cruising speed will not make a huge time difference if you are having to stop and start for the lights regularly anyway.

Maybe you can put the seat up a little bit. Do you drink as much water on the road bike? If your used to wearing a camel back, it can be easy to forget to grab your bottle.

Don't really have an answer for the specific fit stuff, it sounds like you know what you need. Being able to comfortably use all the different positions in the drops might help with your fatigue as well though- especially if there isn't a dense wrapping of bar tape on the top part of the bars.

 

[nik_1974]

its only my second day of commuting

Do you mean on your roadie as opposed to the MTB?

If so you may take a while to get used to the roadie. No front suspension and thinner tyres will be creating more shock through the bike and onto your body. This could be the source of your fatigue. I does take a bit to get used to.

 

[ja_har]

I have been commuting to work on a roadie as opposed to a HT MTB of late and this is what I am noticing.

Disclaimer: All of this is perceived as opposed to scientifically measured (via stop watch, HRM etc etc), so take it easy.

- My speeds (top speed and cruising speed) seem faster ... but my overall time is roughly the same if not marginally slower ??? (My computer isn't fully operational yet so more science later)

- I think I'm taking the hills faster ... but the corners and down hill bits slower. I accelerate faster by brake or back off earlier. so my roadie bike handling sux balls.

After many years of commuting the same route as you on a slicked up MTB...one thing I will say. I think your time will stay about the same...for the exact reason you state, MTB will be faster on the corners and downhill bits...roadie on the flats/ uphill

After years of non scientific reaserch (Ie riding the same route) there isnt a roadie that can keep my tail though the corners, pinch climbs or steep twisty parts, but I cant hang on in a straight line to a fastish roadie.

Overall seems about the same for that distance/route...

Obvious conclusion is that riding a roadie makes you forget how to turn a corner

 

[Lanky Love]

Sorry to get off topic a little, but do you guys find your roadie slower through corners?

Sure I could never take my roadie (or a cyclocross bike) through corners on dirt or single track as well as I can on my mtb, but on the road, I feel a lot safer and faster cornering on a road bike than a mtb. I would naver hit a corner on my mtb as fast as I do on my road bike.

 

[ja_har]

corner speed?

Having never ridden a roadie I cant comment other than my own observations noted above. The commute has some very tight twisty and in places bumpy or steepish corners/hairpins. The roadies seem to struggle around them in comparison to holding speed on a MTB with 1.5/1.25 slicks combo.

More open sweeping corners would probably be different.

 

[Ham]

i corner and descend quicker on the roadie as apposed to the mtb, on the flat with no wind 40 kmh is not uncommon for me 28-30 kmh was about the max on the mtb.

 

[Nerf Herder]

Firstly Cheers fellas.

Just to clarify we're talking approx 20-25mins of relatively high to moderate efforts ... so not big licks of effort.

Fatigue is mainly in the legs

*snip ... Are there many traffic lights on your route?
*snip ... Do you drink as much water on the road bike?

There are some lights and pedestrian traffic closer to work ... but more of it is bike lane or shared paths. I would have thought the additional acceleration would cancel out any losses related to stop start (compared with the MTB).

Re: Water ... I'm not drinking any during ... but I load up a couple hours prior to leaving in the afternoon ... and a little prior in the morning. (the fatigue is mainly in the afternoon session)

Do you mean on your roadie as opposed to the MTB?

If so you may take a while to get used to the roadie. No front suspension and thinner tyres will be creating more shock through the bike and onto your body. This could be the source of your fatigue. I does take a bit to get used to.

Yep to the first question ... only the second session on the roadie ... after a hiatus for approx 3 months. (I've been doing alot of XC and DH and general stuffing about on the SS street rig ... lately though ... so don't think its a fitness thing)

Overall seems about the same for that distance/route...

Yeah ... I kinda rationalised that ... for exactly like you said ... so not really confused about the times ... more the fatigue ... given mushrooms comments it may be cause I'm not hydrated enough *shrugs also the comments about road chatter from Nik ... I don't think there is that much ... but I'll see next ride if its noticeable.

Sorry to get off topic a little, but do you guys find your roadie slower through corners?

No Probs ... I'm heaps faster thru downhill corners on the MTB ... flat and uphill corners I'm way way faster on the roadie ... any tricky and quick changes in direction I'm way more comfortable on the MTB.


Anyways ... Ta ... I'll see if drinking and lifting the seat a little more will do something.

Cheers

 

[goldman]

I find that I take corners faster on the roadie than on the XC bike but the geometry of roadies and mtbs are quite different and when I first started riding the road I found it difficult to commit to corners at higher speeds - particularly on the drops. I now find it quite comfortable railing corners at speeds that I wouldn't do on the mtb.

I have seen the same thing with other riders, even very talented mtbers (as opposed to me!) take a little time to get comfortable with the different geometry and response you get from a roadie...

So give it a while and I would expect you to start to feel more 'at one' with the road...

 

[bear the bear]

OK lets get this out of the way first...MTB's don't corner faster then a road bike on a flat surface turn. Example cornering during an elite road crit is 40-55kph depending on geometry.
MTB XC, hole shot to corner maybe 35kph.

Right now to answer your question, 1) Have you checked your postion of your roadie vs MTB? 2) It's the magnitude/ number of accelerations that are screwing you. At the end of the day we all have a book of matches to burn in terms of accelerating. If you're burning more matches than in your book then thats one answer. The other is the matches are burning brighter then what your used to on the MTB ie the accelerations are more brutal. At the end of the day you are only going to be able to answer this by recording your ride using a bike computer then comparing against a mtb ride on the same route.

 

[a.davis12]

fo sho its a different position!

it may feel and look similar, but its likely that you are in fairly different angles on the roadie compared to mtb, which is making different muscles work.

different muscles which havent been used a lot previously = dead tired.

so in short your logic is sound, you need to get used to it.

 

[Carlin]

You might be tired because you have been thinking too much

Seriously, maybe just try to relax and slow down a little bit, and you might even go faster.

My roadie is a little skittish and wants to go fast, so sometimes it takes a conscious effort just to slow things down a bit.

 

[ntj]

I don't want to tell you that the answers all lie in upgrades Al, but they worked for me...

You mentioned stem length - even when I dropped 10 mm, my bike went into corners easier. More compact bars did the same again.

It still didn't seem right though. I ditched the Vittoria tyres for for Conti 4000s and things got better. Then a stiffer, lighter wheelset came along, and the difference was huge. Things got much more chuckable.

My times got much better than my MTB commuter - not saying much cos that thing is a tank.

 

[Nerf Herder]

You might be tired because you have been thinking too much

Yeah prolly ... I find my self thinking, "am I pushing too big a gear .. click down, then I'm thinking am I spinning to high ... " bah ... thanks to bear I'm now gonna be thinking about "matches"

On to topic two ... my comments and I think Ja_Har's too, is more about downhill cornering ... no way a roadie is faster round corners pointed anywhere near slighly down.

I can smell the first annual Farkin Roadie vs MTB downhill corner shoot out.

I bet from the crest of Anzac Bridge down thru the ramp heading towards Channel Ten ... my mighty Apollo versus any roadie ... first one onto the road ... without getting taken out by a car at the exit ... wins (no sweeping of glass round the corners allowed ... wah wah wah)

*edit heee heeee Nige ... the answer is always to upgrade

 

[tassiskibum]

There is no way a mtb is faster down hills than a roadie, having just got into the swing of descents on the roadie i can now corner at 60-65km/h on sweeping bends down off mt wellington. there was no way i was hitting that on a mountain bike. Its all about confidence and commitment on a roadie, a mountain bike is alot easier to push hard through corners, but once dialed a roadie will be miles ahead.

 

[czecharch]

I suspect your position on the bike might be different.

It would be worthwhile checking your relative saddle fore-aft position in relation to the bottom bracket with a plumb bob. This in my experience has a huge effect on which muscle groups are being recruited in the pedal stroke.

You've spoken about the stem length being 20-30 mm longer on the road bike. This is also likely to pull you more forward whilst putting power down.

As I've recently bought a new bike to replace the older one (mountain bikes), I have changed my relative fore-aft position by about 20mm forward. I found that I had little power climbing for a period of about 6 weeks. Also, I found that the muscles lower down in my quads (medialis?) during that time were the ones that were being hammered rather than my glutes.

The good news is that I did become acclimatised over time and now feel stronger than before.

Hope you get faster.

 

[Nerf Herder]

*snip ... Also, I found that the muscles lower down in my quads (medialis?) during that time were the ones that were being hammered rather than my glutes.

The good news is that I did become acclimatised over time and now feel stronger than before.

Hope you get faster.

Cheers ... thats very similar to what I'm feeling (lower quads meaning nearer your knees right) ... will have a play see if that does something. Ta

tassiskibum
Physical Challenge ... pics or it didn't happen

I'll take all your words for it ... roadies are faster round corners ... cool

Thanks for the feedback and comments ... lots for me to work with.

I've now shortened the stem by 20mm ... I'll bring some water during the next ride ... I'll play with the seat position ... I'll monitor road chatter ... all without thinking too much and lighting too many matches

I've also bought some new batteries for the comp ... see whether this is all in my head.

 

[Carlin]

On the topic of what is faster down a hill: roadie or mountain bike?

I seem to remember a downhill road time trial, where Myles Rockwell won the event on his standard road bike. That was ahead of Brian Lopes and others on somewhat modified mountain bikes.

 

[b_S]

I can smell the first annual Farkin Roadie vs MTB downhill corner shoot out.

I bet from the crest of Anzac Bridge down thru the ramp heading towards Channel Ten ... my mighty Apollo versus any roadie ... first one onto the road ... without getting taken out by a car at the exit ... wins (no sweeping of glass round the corners allowed ... wah wah wah)

I'll be in on that, representing the fat tire side of things. That section made my CBD commuting fun.
You can do more silly things on an MTB and get away with it than on a roadie, so really it all depends on conditions - skittish surface or mid-corner emergency manoeuvres is where the fat tyres would be faster, and I know for Sydney this is pretty much the norm when getting around the inner 'burbs.

 

[ghettro]

Cancellara descending
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_wEG2RNMJc

Back to topic...
I'd say that due to shorter wheelbase, more weight over the front, steeper head angles and lower center of gravity that a road bike is faster around corners than an MTB as long as the road surface is reasonably smooth.