The argument for singlespeed

[cramhobart]

Umm I think you'll find its only 1271m= 4194 ish? And the route you describe is well over 20km.

 

[harmonix1234]

Umm I think you'll find its only 1271m= 4194 ish? And the route you describe is well over 20km.

Alright, you got me on the finer details. I'll rephrase for you.
Although the exact figures are not to your required detail, I think you will find that it does not detract from the difficulty of the challenge I formerly presented.

Ever tried climbing well over 20kms, '4194 (ish) ft' straight up on a 44/15?

Now the altitude and distance is more accurate, It dosn't really make it any easier now does it?

 

[cramhobart]

Alright, you got me on the finer details. I'll rephrase for you.
Although the exact figures are not to your required detail, I think you will find that it does not detract from the difficulty of the challenge I formerly presented.

Ever tried climbing well over 20kms, '4194 (ish) ft' straight up on a 44/15?

Now the altitude and distance is more accurate, It dosn't really make it any easier now does it?

Climbing in 44/15 is certainly a challenge, however 6000ft over 20km is a very
different proposition than 4200 over 30km. Can't be bothered doing the maths to work out the gradient but you get my drift.And yes the difference does make it easier.

 

[pearcy78]

mmm you got me browsing now , just had 2 cartlidge tears repaired and only have a single speed at the moment,while tears not caused by the bike riding ,is riding a single speed now good for me?this i must take into consideration.more googling required

 

[Tacky Monster]

I've given it a go. I got a cheap SS off ebay - great price, great components.

I ride at Stromlo and have been feeling a bit flat lately with all the mud and wondering what I am doing to my presious bikes so I thought I'd get a cheap SS and give it a go. It is now my mud bashing bike. I enjoyed the climb, it was challenging and my legs were trashed, even my abs were sore! I liked the descent, it is making me try and ride smoother and watch my lines (I also haven't ridden a hard tail for a while). When I went through mud I didn't care, this is my mud bashing bike afterall. If I only had one bike it wouldn't be a SS or a hard tail but for something different and a new challenge it was great. I also don't think I could handle riding on it for long periods of time. But when I only have an hour or so to spare I think it will be my bike of choice, I will certainly get a good workout in that hour!

 

[atschool]

mmm you got me browsing now , just had 2 cartlidge tears repaired and only have a single speed at the moment,while tears not caused by the bike riding ,is riding a single speed now good for me?this i must take into consideration.more googling required

I'd say probably not. I posted up this link earlier in the thread. It's about knee problems caused by fixies but is applicable to single speed in many respects IMO. Probably better to err on the side of caution.

 

[Arete]

It's about knee problems caused by fixies but is applicable to single speed in many respects IMO.

No it's not. Resistance braking on a fixed gear bicycle is completely different from pedaling forwards in terms of physics and biomechanics - in that you have to overcome the force with which you are traveling forward by resisting the forward motion of your pedals before any braking occurs, which puts significantly more strain on your joints than pedaling forwards.
It's like saying that as it's been shown poorly aligned cleats on a road bike can cause serious knee injury, no one should use flat pedals in case you ride with your feet misaligned.
Dislike singlespeeds if you must but attributing knee damage to it from that study is spurious.

 

[Zoom]

use a sensible gear on your single speed? Cycling's been around for a lot longer than the derailleur

What a silly remark. Horses as a form of transport have been around a lot longer than cars but you don't see many horses on the freeway do you?

People forget why gears were put on bikes. It's for a much better energy transfer and it reduce damage to your knees.
I don't see too many winners of the Tour de France riding single speeds. Do you?

 

[Cronar]

I love riding both, But find myself riding the SS much more these days. I was sold as soon as i was ripping down a rough bit of single track hearing only the noise of my tyres gripping dirt and the click of the rear hub... and NO chain slap.

Also, when i started riding the SS i lost 8kgs and got one hell of a lot fitter/stronger.

Don't hate people, we're all just out there having a bit fun.

 

[Arete]

What a silly remark. Horses as a form of transport have been around a lot longer than cars but you don't see many horses on the freeway do you?

I guess we should all stop riding our bikes and get in cars too then. I don't see anyone in the tour de France not pedaling hard either. Of course you go faster up and down mountians with gears, no one's debating the fact

 

[atschool]

No it's not. Resistance braking on a fixed gear bicycle is completely different from pedaling forwards in terms of physics and biomechanics - in that you have to overcome the force with which you are traveling forward by resisting the forward motion of your pedals before any braking occurs, which puts significantly more strain on your joints than pedaling forwards.
It's like saying that as it's been shown poorly aligned cleats on a road bike can cause serious knee injury, no one should use flat pedals in case you ride with your feet misaligned.
Dislike singlespeeds if you must but attributing knee damage to it from that study is spurious.

First of all, notice the hedging I used in my previous post. I never said 'riding a fixie=riding a single speed' so no need to get all uptight about it. It was this part of the study that I was referring to:

Across the board, it is universally accepted by medical experts that high-gear, low-cadence pedaling has a high likelihood of causing knee pain and permanent injury. The main preventative measure as well as primary remedy for that problem is low-gear, high-cadence riding, which is only possible with the ability to change to appropriate gears throughout a ride. Fixed-gear riders are unable to avail themselves of that remedy, and because of that, they experience more frequent and higher pressures on the knee than a rider on a bike with gears.

Now how is that not relevant to single speed riding?

 

[Arete]

First of all, notice the hedging I used in my previous post. I never said 'riding a fixie=riding a single speed' so no need to get all uptight about it. It was this part of the study that I was referring to:


Now how is that not relevant to single speed riding?

Firstly it isn't a study, it's a blog. - the quote you've exerpted is not a "study" it's from a blog post devoted to how much some guy (albeit a well researched guy) on the internet hates fixies.

original source: http://yamabushi.wordpress.com/2007/07/03/why-fixies-are-bad-for-your-knees/

knee pain due to high gear low cadence riding is most commonly, according to the various medical articles cited by the blog, attributed to hill training in road cyclists. It could be argued that a geared bike, by allowing you to mash the big ring put you at more risk than a smaller geared single speed.

Next - the knee damage that's widely accepted as a danger of riding fixed is due to resistance braking - the force is determined by momentum of rider and bike and resisted by locking muscles to resist it, thus transferring said force through the joints .

Either way, the so called medical risks associated with a freewheeled bicycle you're promoting as significant are not.

 

[atschool]

snip

You're right, it was from a blog. But excerpts from studies say essentially the same thing. As in:

Excerpted from:
Knee Pain and Cycling
by Joshua Cohen, PT MS

Gearing choices can become an important variable in preventing the progression of chondromalacia patella. When the leg is forcefully extended, as during a cyclist’s power stoke, the knee cap acts as a pulley to transfer the large forces of the quads across the knee joint to the tibia (one of the lower leg bones). As a result, a component of the tendon forces pulls the knee towards the knee joint, greatly increasing the pressure on the back of the kneecap. This pressure can wear down the joint surfaces. Normally, a thin layer of slippery fluid lubricates the joint and prevents wear. However, during slow, forceful extensions (think big chainring grinding uphill) this fluid becomes displaced and the joint loses much of its lubrication. This is not good for your knees or pistons!

Keeping a higher cadence will help to reduce the pressure of the knee cap against the knee joint, allowing the lubricating fluid to remain between the joint surfaces where it belongs, and so lessening the risk of joint surface breakdown. Cadences above 80rpm are generally better for your joints than knee-mashing 60 rpm cadences. Remember to choose your gear inches wisely and take into consideration the terrain and your ability to power your gear to maintain a relatively high cadence.”

We're mountain bikers, so riding up hills is part and parcel of it all. If you're riding single speed, you don't have the luxury of sitting down and spinning on the steeper climbs. I'm not saying that you can't damage your knees on geared bikes, of course you can. But most of us "gearies" will change to lower gear when the going gets tough. It's all about being in the right gear at the right time.

Anyway, let's not forget the bigger picture and the reason that we're talking about this to begin with.

mmm you got me browsing now , just had 2 cartlidge tears repaired and only have a single speed at the moment,while tears not caused by the bike riding ,is riding a single speed now good for me?this i must take into consideration.more googling required

I said it's probably best to err on the side of caution and stay off the SS bike. What's your answer?

 

[Arete]

What's your answer?

It depends. Choice of gearing is one of a multitude of factors.

What sort of tears were they and how were they repaired? What sort of physio regimen are you on? If you've had the enitre meniscus replaced with a prosthetic piece as I have, there's no risk of further cartilage damage.

What sort of riding are you doing? What terrain? Downhilling vs all day mountain epics vs cycle touring vs riding to the shops vs ....

Gearing choice? Clips or no? General fitness? etc and so on.

Answer will vary accordingly - and the choice of SS vs gears would be one factor in many.

 

[pearcy78]

tears on front and rear of medial cartlidge, repaired, trimmed back pretty much,knee joint re shaped(bones) ridin is single track and fireroad gearing 33/20 ,just in case i have already ordered the 2011 merida 29er , if i have the best if both worlds and not riding single speed all the time ,may be ok , if not the singlespeed i,ll just sell

 

[pearcy78]

as for an answer to the original question in this forum,im not a weight weenie , but wanted to try 1 a 29er and 2 ss , love both no gears to break , no noise, technical ridin ,strenght and fitness have all improved,so im sure ill be a better rider back on a geared bike, not sure i would go 26inch singlespeed though

 

[CP]

I'm new to SS (well since my BMX days). I've only ridden on fiarly flat ground, but enjoy the silence over obstacles.

A few people have mentioned not having to think about changing gears. I agree with this, but not that it's a hard thing to do, but because you're not tempted to overshift. There have been quite a few small hills where I'd usually downshift 4 gears on my main rig, but on the SS I can't be lazy and end up surprising myself. So yeah you don't have to look ahead and calculate your shifts according to the terrain, you just need to work out how early you need to hit the turbo button. I like that.

However for the majority of my actually mountain biking, I'll still take a geared bike. Maybe it's because the people I ride with would just shoot off and I'd be left behind, it's probably also because I'm still not overly excited about hardtails. It's probably because I love my Reign too much

I have an appreciation for both, and will use my SS when I know the terrain is fairly flat, or it's just a roost to the shops.

 

[Arete]

You're right, it was from a blog. But excerpts from studies say essentially the same thing. As in:

That's not a study either - it's yet another blog post. http://www.63xc.com/joshc/kneepain.htm

pearcy - I'd say it's mostly an issue of taking it easy and easing back in - go too hard on any bike and you could make the tears worse, and end up needing a replaced meniscus.

It's important not to push through knee pain like you would muscular pain.

 

[atschool]

That's not a study either - it's yet another blog post written by a guy with some important letters after his name that signify that he knows a lot more about knee damage and cycling than a bunch of dudes on a mountain bike forum.http://www.63xc.com/joshc/kneepain.htm

Fixed for you.

 

[Arete]

Fixed for you.

My point is it turns out your "study" is a blog post of a blog post of a blog post by a personal trainer with an unspecified MSc degree - and therefore an opinion rather than any sort of study.

FWIW I got more letters than him anyway.