Wheel Build Advice Thread

[PJO]

Exactly like @Litenbror said. Just be methodical, start at the valve hole and go round each of the spokes one one side giving them a quarter turn, then do the other side.
I use a bit of masking tape stuck just above the spoke key on a spoke I'm tightening to see make sure I am actually giving it a tighten rather than just twisting the spoke. If it is an old wheel or the nipples are stiff you might want to do this for the loosening part as well.

 

[safreek]

I guess you fellas are right, went to the lbs and asked him if he can do it, he said he could but I should really have a crack at it myself. If I fuck it up he would sort it out.
Damn, what ever happened to a society where money solved all problems, I've been conned

 

[blacksp20]

For those interested in ordering parts from the UK during COVID...

I ordered custom cut spokes and nipples through spokesfromryan.com on 4/8. They were packed and sent on 11/8. Sadly sat around in the UK for almost 3 weeks, arriving in Melbourne on 31/8 and then 2 days to get to NSW.

Sapim spokes and nipples for 2 wheels with spares delivered for under A$80. Can’t fault Ryan on price, service and quality. Would recommend for those building wheels that aren’t in a hurry to get parts.

 

[Shredden]

Ordered some rims (Stans Flow MK3 at CRC) and hubs (DT350 at HiBike) last night. Thinking I'll get the Sapim Race double butted spokes and brass nipples from spokesfromryan as above.

I'm using the DT spoke length calculator which seems pretty straightforward. Just hoping someone can explain the pros and cons of 12mm vs 14mm vs 16mm nipples? What would you guys use on a build like this?

 

[The Duckmeister]

Really only need longer nipples if the rim wall is quite thick so they reach through properly. In any case the spokes should thread right up into the nipple heads.

 

[PJO]

12mm is plenty long enough for Stans rims.
Get brass ones if you want less hassles.

 

[Flow-Rider]

14mm has more purchase for the spoke tool I've found, 16mm is ridiculously long.

 

[Shredden]

Thanks guys - another quick one.. These are the recommended spoke lengths from DT.

Looks like they always round down - but I'm curious as to:

• why 277.4 is rounded to 276, not 277?
• why 275.2 is rounded to 274, not 275?

Given that the Sapim spokes are available in 1mm increments would I be better off rounding down to the nearest whole number, or following the DT recommendations? Does it even matter??

 

[Flow-Rider]

Thanks guys - another quick one.. These are the recommended spoke lengths from DT.

Looks like they always round down - but I'm curious as to:

• why 277.4 is rounded to 276, not 277?
• why 275.2 is rounded to 274, not 275?

Given that the Sapim spokes are available in 1mm increments would I be better off rounding down to the nearest whole number, or following the DT recommendations? Does it even matter??

View attachment 367060

Hard to get odd number spokes lengths for some reason, all shops don't seem to have them in stock usually, you can get them but just not common. It's always better getting closer to the listed number if possible.

 

[The Duckmeister]

Might be allowing for the spokes stretching under tension; fine-gauge spokes can stretch a surprising amount, and can run out of thread.

 

[damo666]

On spoke tension, any ghetto ways to measure?

I'll be swapping some new rims onto a wheelset - Stans Arch to Flow. Borrowing a truing stand and I'm OK with the physical swap (tape new rim to the old, and swap spokes to the new rim progressively).

How do I get the spoke tension right without a proper tensioning tool?

 

[blacksp20]

Got my front wheel built, spank 350 rim with Sapim race spokes. TM-1 results are attached. What do you guys think of the numbers? Is the DS a bit low at ~90kgf compared to NDS ~137kgf? Spank suggest 120-140kgf spoke tension so I can’t go any higher on NDS. Is it even possible to increase DS without increasing NDS?

 

[blacksp20]

On spoke tension, any ghetto ways to measure?

I'll be swapping some new rims onto a wheelset - Stans Arch to Flow. Borrowing a truing stand and I'm OK with the physical swap (tape new rim to the old, and swap spokes to the new rim progressively).

How do I get the spoke tension right without a proper tensioning tool?

I’d assume you go off feel. I only just got a tension meter and I was surprised how low 120-140kgf actually feels. If I was going off feeling alone, which I have done in the past when truing my old wheels, I’d probably put over 200kgf in them before I thought they were done.

 

[creaky]

Got my front wheel built, spank 350 rim with Sapim race spokes. TM-1 results are attached. What do you guys think of the numbers? Is the DS a bit low at ~90kgf compared to NDS ~137kgf? Spank suggest 120-140kgf spoke tension so I can’t go any higher on NDS. Is it even possible to increase DS without increasing NDS?

140kgf is up there for an alloy rim, isn’t it?

The tension chart looks good. 90kgf should be enough tension on the DS to avoid detensioning. I wouldn’t be inclined to go higher than that on the NDS just to get rhe

 

[PJO]

On spoke tension, any ghetto ways to measure?

I'll be swapping some new rims onto a wheelset - Stans Arch to Flow. Borrowing a truing stand and I'm OK with the physical swap (tape new rim to the old, and swap spokes to the new rim progressively).

How do I get the spoke tension right without a proper tensioning tool?

Have you got a set of built wheels with similar sized spokes (both length and diameter). Could get a feel from those.
Also, as you're getting towards final tension on the drive side rear (non-drive front) the spokes will twist substantially before actually tightening. I use a lubricant (Lanotech) on my spoke threads and get more than a 1/4-1/3 of a turn of wind up with DT Comps (2.0/1.8mm double butted) when getting to final tension. Less so on straight guage (maybe up to 1/4 turn).
The reason I notice this is that as I build I use a little masking tape "flag" on each spoke just above the spoke wrench, and after each time I've tightened I untwist the spoke to get it back to its original position.

 

[teK--]

Not really any ghetto way to measure tension but you can squeeze the spokes from a known good wheel with same thickness spokes to get a comparison. Also can pluck and compare the sound if it's a similar tone.

 

[The Duckmeister]

Got my front wheel built, spank 350 rim with Sapim race spokes. TM-1 results are attached. What do you guys think of the numbers? Is the DS a bit low at ~90kgf compared to NDS ~137kgf? Spank suggest 120-140kgf spoke tension so I can’t go any higher on NDS. Is it even possible to increase DS without increasing NDS?

With any dished wheel (flanges unequally distant from the hub centre), the more outboard side - in the case of a front wheel, the non-disc side - will always be lower tension than the high-load side. The exact difference will vary depending on a few factors. Build the high-tension side up to spec, and the other side will be what it will be. Getting the tensions within each side even is more critical.

140kgf is up there for an alloy rim, isn’t it?

Yeah, it's well up there, but must be OK if the manufacturer specs it. I normally build aluminium rims to around 110kgf, sometimes lower if they're particularly light - too much tension makes the rims unstable, as well as more prone to cracking at the spoke holes.

 

[northvanguy]

Question for the experts... and please excuse my ignorance.

Cased a jump today... heard a real bang... spoke gone... vanished. Just nipple in rim rattling about now. So likely a stripped nipple meaning a real pain to replace as will need to remove tire and tape.

RF Vault straight pull hubs.

Thankfully wheel comes with spare spokes.

Issue on trail was a loose spoke near the broken one which no matter how hard I tried to hold the spoke I couldn't get it to stop spinning as I tightened. Annoying.

Now here's my stupid question (I will go to fuckwits thread at some point). How does straight pull even work? Given you drop the spoke through the hub and then lace it to rim... when there's a hard impact on the rim what stops the spoke from not just giving and moving out of the hub?? With jbend I presume the spoke would bend and break somewhere in the middle (had that happen enough times).

This is my first straight pull hub and I'm a bit perplexed.

I look forward to the abuse for being a dim wit.

 

[hifiandmtb]

SP spokes suck. This was my "spoke spinning during nipple replacement" solution:

 

[CHEWY]

... when there's a hard impact on the rim what stops the spoke from not just giving and moving out of the hub??

The spokes on the opposite side of the wheel are taking the load in tension. Spokes do not take any compression load.