COVID-19: who’s going full doomsday prep on this?

moorey said:
Might have missed one on both. He said $10,000 If business closes, or a $1000 fine. $100,000 and a $10,000 does sound more like it.
It’s all one on one, with less interaction and then a hairdresser or a beautician, so it doesn’t make a lot of sense that he is not allowed to operate at this point.
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Hairdressers were opened to lift the spirits and calm the unrest that had started to spill over.. Unfortunately vic restrictions weren’t solely based on the medical advice, as soon as you add politicans to the mix it goes to shit.. Anastasia Palaszczuk, Mark McGowan and (lesser) Steven Marshall are prime examples also..
 
mike14 said:
It's all a bit weird with the latest round of announcements.
  • Kids in Yrs 8-10 can't go back to school yet but can hang out at a skate-park all day
  • Allegedly the '4 reasons to leave your house' rules still apply but you can now get a haircut as well, which has been deemed as 'essential' even though up until today they all had to be closed. Hairdressers, while having no more or less contact than other beauty places get to open while the others don't
  • I can have up to 5 tradies in my house, but can't have 2 customers in my clothes shop. I also can't have 5 other family members in my house...
  • 30 people can swim through each others pee (and spit) in an outdoor pool, but only 10 can attend an outdoor exercise class
  • A personal one; I can access all of metropolitan melbourne and interact with 1000s, inside and outside as much as I want, but I can't take my wife to see her parents, or ride my bike on my own at the Youies (or Red Hill)
I'm sure there's modelling that shows all of the above making total sense, and there will always be anomalies, but it would be interesting to see it as a lot of the new stuff just appears to be "make shit up based on whatever interest group is either making the most noise, or donating the most $$'
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I think everyone gets way too hung up on the specifics of these rules. They can't make a solution that fits everyone's specific situation.
Its limiting the total movement of people, as Andrews has to keep repeating to the media, the aggregate... has to be done on a macro scale.
 
CHEWY said:
I think everyone gets way too hung up on the specifics of these rules. They can't make a solution that fits everyone's specific situation.
Its limiting the total movement of people, as Andrews has to keep repeating to the media, the aggregate... has to be done on a macro scale.
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Of course they do, there will be never be a 'one size fits all' approach, but when people have to comply with specifics they are going to look at and judge them as they impact and relate to their lives and act accordingly, while questioning apparent contradictions and irregularities .
I would argue that based on most available data I've seen, limiting interactions, especially indoors, would be more beneficial than limiting movement, but that option seems to be unpopular so we'll leave it alone
 
moorey said:
It's not always about collateral damage.
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CHEWY said:
I think everyone gets way too hung up on the specifics of these rules. They can't make a solution that fits everyone's specific situation.
Its limiting the total movement of people, as Andrews has to keep repeating to the media, the aggregate... has to be done on a macro scale.
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Depends on how much those specifics impact your life. For some it must be really shit.

I get that the initial reaction needed to be at this level asthere were too many unknowns. But now that we know what the vulnerable population is why can’t all the efforts be placed there to protect these people and open up the rest of society to manage our own risk against the virus.
 
Kerplunk said:
It’s not always about business either.. A lot of people struggling that has nothing to do with coin..
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Care to share your insight on how we could have avoided the numbers pretty much everywhere else in the world is facing without the downsides? Yes, there are horrific downsides for plenty of people. It’s been little more than an inconvenience for me, but that doesn’t make me blind to what is happening.
I have plenty of criticisms of Andrews, but I do have a lot of respect for Norman Swann et al, and from a human casualty perspective, we have done what pretty much no one else has....and they will additionally suffer greater economically, on top of the deaths.
What am I missing?
 
Halo1 said:
But now that we know what the vulnerable population is why can’t all the efforts be placed there to protect these people and open up the rest of society to manage our own risk against the virus.
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Healthcare workers mainly, IMHO. They will bare the additional brunt, and despite every effort, they are incredibly vulnerable.
 
Minlak said:
People in general have had enough - Recent information has events like these running their courses in around 18 mths no matter what you do - So that puts us in this yo-yo situation until at least August / October 2021.

So think about the mantra you get from social media and in fact main stream media (especially reality tv (the voice etc)) - "Don't let anything stand in your way" - "People told me know but I kept pushing" - "I didn't give up" - Successful and the apparantly successful all talk about drive and not giving in or up - These are just everyday people now that had designs on a better life for themselves and their families and constantly being told no with the added pressure of the perception that if you do the right thing you will be safe (mask - sterilise - distance) and that if you are healthy the virus is pretty much a non event for you.
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No doubt people are fed up. I was restless enough after a few weeks of the very light weight restrictions in NSW at the beginning of the crisis, I am limited to attempting to imagine what it would be like to be locked down for this long. But surely that would be enough motivation to hold out these last days/weeks and not undo the benefits of all that suffering?
 
moorey said:
Care to share your insight on how we could have avoided the numbers pretty much everywhere else in the world is facing without the downsides? Yes, there are horrific downsides for plenty of people. It’s been little more than an inconvenience for me, but that doesn’t make me blind to what is happening.
I have plenty of criticisms of Andrews, but I do have a lot of respect for Norman Swann et al, and from a human casualty perspective, we have done what pretty much no one else has....and they will additionally suffer greater economically, on top of the deaths.
What am I missing?
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Singapore & South Korea have controlled far bigger outbreaks in higher density living without going to the lockdown extent of Victoria.. I respect Norman Swan but he is wrong on that one and has been called out on it..
There is always going to be downsides but that doesn’t mean we have to have a near entire shutdown of society for months on end..
As the asian countries like Singapore, Vietnam, etc have shown you need a robust infectious health system to track/trace/isolate to be able to “live with covid”.. Victoria didn’t have that and playing catch up..
That’s how you avoid huge case numbers while minimising the downsides.. The WHO has been warning against using lockdowns from the very beginning as well..
 
Kerplunk said:
Singapore & South Korea have controlled far bigger outbreaks in higher density living without going to the lockdown extent of Victoria.. I respect Norman Swan but he is wrong on that one and has been called out on it..
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I have mates in South Korea. Trust me, their restrictions when it all kicked off back in March/ April because of those church loonies were way worse. Addresses could only leave their apartments on certain days of the week. Mandatory masks, and masks were being rationed at one stage with two per individual per week. Seoul had a tighter curfew, fewer members of the household were allowed out at one time, temp checks everywhere, track and trace via QR code for entry into just about anything, total closure of green spaces.
 
Not sure what sort of hubris makes you think you know better than Swann? I sure don’t, or the WHO, but it’s advice has been pretty inconsistent over the last 10 months.
 
Minlak said:
Recent information has events like these running their courses in around 18 mths no matter what you do - So that puts us in this yo-yo situation until at least August / October 2021.
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Yep 2 winters is the average flu pandemic duration in past history.. The virus doesn’t go away but people generally give up and it passes through the population eventually becoming endemic.. Be interesting with this one, because the more you lockdown and suppress it the longer the pandemic drags on.. If we don’t find a treatment or vaccine by next year I wonder if we will have to go back to the old “flatten the curve” strategy..
 
rangersac said:
I have mates in South Korea. Trust me, their restrictions when it all kicked off back in March/ April because of those church loonies were way worse. Addresses could only leave their apartments on certain days of the week. Mandatory masks, and masks were being rationed at one stage with two per individual per week. Seoul had a tighter curfew, fewer members of the household were allowed out at one time, temp checks everywhere, track and trace via QR code for entry into just about anything, total closure of green spaces.
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Yes but the second wave they didn’t go anywhere neatlr as hardcore is my understanding?
 
Kerplunk said:
Singapore & South Korea have controlled far bigger outbreaks in higher density living without going to the lockdown extent of Victoria.. I respect Norman Swan but he is wrong on that one and has been called out on it..
There is always going to be downsides but that doesn’t mean we have to have a near entire shutdown of society for months on end..
As the asian countries like Singapore, Vietnam, etc have shown you need a robust infectious health system to track/trace/isolate to be able to “live with covid”.. Victoria didn’t have that and playing catch up..
That’s how you avoid huge case numbers while minimising the downsides.. The WHO has been warning against using lockdowns from the very beginning as well..
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Thought I'd do a bit of fact checking. I'll just leave this here. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_COVID-19_pandemic_in_Singapore
 
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