The O/T Giant Anthem thread
- Thread starter floz
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Grover
Likes Bikes and Dirt
yeah cul, you weren't seeing things - it was there - no more details though
about the weight - 2448 grams for a large frame (anthem 1) with shock. seeing as it's the same spec as an xtc composite i'd say they're about 11.4 for a large anthem 1 (xtc comp is 10.3-10.4 and a large frame is 1.4kg). the anthem le will be lighter due to xtr and manitou spec.
take into account that that is real weight - most claimed weights don't include pedals and even then are still less than what the bike actually weighs.
about the weight - 2448 grams for a large frame (anthem 1) with shock. seeing as it's the same spec as an xtc composite i'd say they're about 11.4 for a large anthem 1 (xtc comp is 10.3-10.4 and a large frame is 1.4kg). the anthem le will be lighter due to xtr and manitou spec.
take into account that that is real weight - most claimed weights don't include pedals and even then are still less than what the bike actually weighs.
Large Anthem frames are quite long in the top tube.
Geometry data:http://www.giantbicycles.net/us/030.000.000/030.000.006.asp?model=11279 then click on geometry data.
This is from the US website as Giant Aust still have not updated their website. For those of us shorter than 6', a medium will be plenty long enough in the top tube. A medium anthem is longer than my old large santacruz blur! The best part is a smaller frame = even less weight. That will set the anthem frames right up there in the lightweight dualie section. I can't wait, I want mine now!
Geometry data:http://www.giantbicycles.net/us/030.000.000/030.000.006.asp?model=11279 then click on geometry data.
This is from the US website as Giant Aust still have not updated their website. For those of us shorter than 6', a medium will be plenty long enough in the top tube. A medium anthem is longer than my old large santacruz blur! The best part is a smaller frame = even less weight. That will set the anthem frames right up there in the lightweight dualie section. I can't wait, I want mine now!
I picked up my Trance 2 on Sunday, so have only had one ride of it so far. Still bedding in the brakes but they seem pretty good (a lot of people I have spoken to rate the Juicy 5's better than the hayes equivalent HFX9's).
The Reba is great however I haven't ever tried any forks in that price range before to be able to give a good comparison. One of the Australian mountain bike mags (mba or abm) gave a good review the lower model of it (Tora or something) though. Not sure whether the Anthem will have it, but the Trance 2 came with a remote (handlebar) motion control switch. Is basically a semi lockout which may be useful for smoother terrain.
The Reba is great however I haven't ever tried any forks in that price range before to be able to give a good comparison. One of the Australian mountain bike mags (mba or abm) gave a good review the lower model of it (Tora or something) though. Not sure whether the Anthem will have it, but the Trance 2 came with a remote (handlebar) motion control switch. Is basically a semi lockout which may be useful for smoother terrain.
I was looking at Trance 2 & Anthem 2 as well - ended up ordering the Anthem 2
At the end of the day I'm trying to do more XC riding with a few races rather than lots of Trails which the Trance would probab be better at.
Also for me a weak part of my riding is hill climbing - so any weight I can save is great - Anthem 2 is lighter than Trance 2.
Also this bike will be my only bike - so with slicks it will double as my road bike for training and occassional road rides, Anthem 2 has front & back lock out - plus the weight advantage as mentioned above.
other points
Anthem frame design looks like a refined version of their maestro
Maybe able to get good deals on Trance 2 when the Anthem 2's hit the stores
At the end of the day I'm trying to do more XC riding with a few races rather than lots of Trails which the Trance would probab be better at.
Also for me a weak part of my riding is hill climbing - so any weight I can save is great - Anthem 2 is lighter than Trance 2.
Also this bike will be my only bike - so with slicks it will double as my road bike for training and occassional road rides, Anthem 2 has front & back lock out - plus the weight advantage as mentioned above.
other points
Anthem frame design looks like a refined version of their maestro
Maybe able to get good deals on Trance 2 when the Anthem 2's hit the stores
DaGonz
Eats Squid
With all due respect... the .5kg's at most difference between the trance 2 and the anthem is going make bugger all to your hill climbing performance. In fact, over a 300m ascent you will infact save yourself a whopping 1.5kJoules of energy assuming you take the same time to climb. As a hint... this two fruits tub I happen to have here (1 serving) has about 330kJoules of energy in it...Cam99 said:
well... ok it'd be a bit more than that because your co-efficient of friction will be less too so your energy lost through various drag components will be slightly less too. So say you weigh about 75kgs, the bike about 12kgs, your camel back about 3 and various clothing bits about 2, that comes to 92kg's all up. half a kilo in that scheme of things is bugger all (.54%). Most of the laws of physics are proportionally linear to mass so you can more or less say things will be .54% faster (very rough guesstimate). that's about 38secs in a 2 hour race.
So while having a slightly lighter bike may save a few minutes here and there... last time I checked, I was like 1.5 hours slower than the top guys over 100km's.
anyway... sorry for the rantish... I just kinda find it well interesting this whole lighter bike/uber light bike argument... uber light wheels however...
Cheers
Gonz - cynical grump
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as much as 38 seconds - wow
I'll try and source some super light carbon parts to increase that to 40 seconds....
point taken ... forget the science ... its all in the mind
I'm comming from a 5 year old 15 kg cheapy hardtail - so hopefully I'll notice some difference in the Anthem 2 - if it ever arrives !
I'll try and source some super light carbon parts to increase that to 40 seconds....
point taken ... forget the science ... its all in the mind
I'm comming from a 5 year old 15 kg cheapy hardtail - so hopefully I'll notice some difference in the Anthem 2 - if it ever arrives !
Sure, 38 seconds can make a big difference. Sometimes. But really, hands off it fellas. Spend a few more hours on your bike each week and you'll take minutes off your race times, not seconds. That goes for pretty much anyone doing less than 20 hours a week on the bike. Gonz's calculations were pretty rough and were for a 2 hour hillclimb, the difference could be even less in an mtb race.hdtvkss said:
Back to the Anthem vs Trance thing. I haven't ridden either, but I know from riding 'race' bikes vs 'trail' bikes that I can't tell the difference in 0.5kg weight but I can tell the difference in handling. Many race bikes are so stretched out and twitchy that they simply don't handle technical singletrack as quickly as a more relaxed bike. Tracks like Arcadia favour a bike that handles well. I often wonder when I'm stuck behind someone on their NRS/Epic/Fuel/etc in techy singletrack how much of the reason they are slower is due to the rider or the bike. I don't remember getting stuck behind people on longer travel 'trail' bikes as often. Could just be my memory though...
Just because a bike is designed to be faster on European or Norba terrain doesn't necessarily make it faster in Australia. I notice that Giant has specced a longer travel fork for Australia because of the generally techy trails over here. I'm curious to know if that has any ill effects on handling?
Putting a 100mm fork on my Epic (1st generation, came stock with 80mm forks) didn't make it handle better. In some respects it was worse, especially on switchbacks, steep hills and fast, smooth corners. Not as much weight over the front wheel anymore and, as it was fairly long, difficult to get your weight over the front wheel to balance it out. When they put 100mm OEM forks on the Epic they altered the frame geometry to suit.
Liam
Bodin
GMBC
Using terms like "hands off it" is fine in general company, but when you don't know the people you're referring to or how much riding/racing they do, you might wanna avoid shootin' you mouth off in a public situation. Especially if you've used these terms in relationship to one point (weight) and then go off on another tangent (geometry).liamo said:
The XC racing industry overall is dominated by questions of bike weight and I don't particularly like being obliquely referred to as a wanker for making the point.
Overall your post raised some good points and your experience in the field is clear, but I'm just offering some friendly advice...
As the Anthem will be my only bike. It will be my commuter & my road bike as well as my XC bike - I'm pretty happy with the weight and geometry.
Personally I think people make too much about handling & geometry. you get used to the bike your riding and that takes time on the bike. You always know the differential when you buy or properly test a new bike - but most people comment on a very narrow band of experience and primarily to justify their own purchasing decisions
I've got a mate with a Trance 2 and a pretty similar level of fitness & skill so when I get my Anthem 2 - I'm more than happy to post some real life comparisons
Personally I think people make too much about handling & geometry. you get used to the bike your riding and that takes time on the bike. You always know the differential when you buy or properly test a new bike - but most people comment on a very narrow band of experience and primarily to justify their own purchasing decisions
I've got a mate with a Trance 2 and a pretty similar level of fitness & skill so when I get my Anthem 2 - I'm more than happy to post some real life comparisons
So an entire industry needs to get its hand off it; zowie.Bodin said:
Weight's easy to obsess over. It's easy to measure and therefore *sell*. But the cost of lopping half a kilo off the average decent bike would be far, far better spent on a week riding somewhere hilly or a coach.
Don't believe the hype.
Fair call. Sorry you took it as an insult, wasn't meant to be one.Bodin said:
The 38 seconds was calculated on the run. I don't have any faith in it, maybe it's right, who knows. The suggestion that the lighter the bike is, the faster your lap times is pretty simplistic, that's all.
Even with road bikes, where to say lighter = faster would be more accurate, there are still high end bikes that are relatively heavy. These are popular because of whole range of reasons: better handling, comfort, responsiveness, durability and marketing.
When looking at MTBs there is a lot more to consider than simply weight; look at the popularity of duallys and the increasing rarity of SIDs. Some people consider weight to be the be all and end all, I would consider a MTB to be a bit more complicated than that.
Liam
Although... rigid singlespeed, no brakes, no seat. I reckon I could climb that hill 52 seconds faster!