Pads for a gravel bike

[Daniel Hale]

r u running compression less housing? makes a decent diff, not too many shops stock it though

swissstop pads work well, pretty sure the nuke proof i ordered were much better also , have found tektro pads poor, only thing below them is shimano resin

 

[Haakon]

I grabbed some TRP cable /hydro HYRD calipers on special for <200 a set. With some research and careful mods ( i run Campagnolo so differing leverage ratio) and quality outers they are really good on my CX /laden gravel bike. Better than previous BB5/BB7/Spyres, regardless of pads with BB7's being best of that lot. It took ages to find the right $$ deal though... lots to be had ~$200 an end.
I am now scouring AliExpess for the right price on some Di2 hydraulic roadie levers to add full hydro to my SS 29er. Going to try with some older xtr calipers.

I've a spare paid of BR-RS785 callipers if you're interested - road version of post mount two piston XT.

 

[DMan]

Not really, confining the hydro bit to the caliper seriously limits any benefit, because that's not where the weakness lies in full cable systems. The longer the cable is, the more it's going to stretch (which in a roundabout way improves modulation, in theory at least), reducing the input force getting into the caliper. With full-length outer - pretty much a given, 'cos it doesn't make much sense to make a disc-brake frame that won't take hydro hoses - there's inherent friction which gets worse as the cables get old & worn. Which further absorbs input power from the rider.

Better hybrid systems have a converter/remote master cylinder unit on the handlebar (the trade off is bulk up there), with very short cables to minimise the losses.

Question though Duck (or anyone who knows!). Do the adapters come off flatmount brakes so you can change rotor size if you want? I'd like to try those ZTTO brakes but they come in a 140mm format and my bike has 160mm rotors...

 

[creaky]

Question though Duck (or anyone who knows!). Do the adapters come off flatmount brakes so you can change rotor size if you want? I'd like to try those ZTTO brakes but they come in a 140mm format and my bike has 160mm rotors...

Don’t go down to a 140mm rotor if you want more power

 

[DMan]

Don’t go down to a 140mm rotor if you want more power

No no, that's why I'm asking if I can just swap adapters over so I can run my 160s

 

[creaky]

No no, that's why I'm asking if I can just swap adapters over so I can run my 160s

Ah, right. Thought you were referring to ztto 140 rotors.

 

[Daniel Hale]

Question though Duck (or anyone who knows!). Do the adapters come off flatmount brakes so you can change rotor size if you want? I'd like to try those ZTTO brakes but they come in a 140mm format and my bike has 160mm rotors...

depends , which frame you got -some have room, a few cannot fit bigger smaller rotors

 

[Daniel Hale]

Not really, confining the hydro bit to the caliper seriously limits any benefit, because that's not where the weakness lies in full cable systems. The longer the cable is, the more it's going to stretch (which in a roundabout way improves modulation, in theory at least), reducing the input force getting into the caliper. With full-length outer - pretty much a given, 'cos it doesn't make much sense to make a disc-brake frame that won't take hydro hoses - there's inherent friction which gets worse as the cables get old & worn. Which further absorbs input power from the rider.

Better hybrid systems have a converter/remote master cylinder unit on the handlebar (the trade off is bulk up there), with very short cables to minimise the losses.

i recently rode a bike with the giant conduct bar mounted reservoir system.(for others -cables go to a reservoir in middle of handlebars, then has tektro hydraulics from there) , the purist crew bag these brakes but i was surprised how well they feel, i had ridden a mates sworks tarmac hydro disc the week before, so had something to compare to but the giant system was every bit as good, lever feel was excellent.

do they sell conduct system separately? i am thinking of putting up a wanted ad for someone who has upgraded

 

[DMan]

depends , which frame you got -some have room, a few cannot fit bigger rotors

I'm not trying to fit bigger... I'm already running 160mm. The ZTTO are 140

 

[Daniel Hale]

I'm not trying to fit bigger... I'm already running 160mm. The ZTTO are 140

whoops..do you already have an adapter on your 160mm brake setup, can not you just remove this to fit the 140mm: no i have seen a 160mm setup which mounted flush, had no adapter and seemingly could not use a 140mm rotor—guy had bought new levers w 140mm rotors supplied

dont think you’ll gain with the ztto, i have some -pretty sure they were worse than spyre’s, there is a better one available - -i’ll try & look up the brand tomorrow, do hope still make their variant it was excellent. i do have a trophy/rd lying around somewhere—want me to send it to you?

PS trust me on the compressionless, Adam at curve runs compressionless w trp spyre s on his monster cross with 600mm wide drop bars, it’s pretty expensive, most shops charge 20/metre

 

[DMan]

whoops..do you already have an adapter on your 160mm brake setup, can not you just remove this to fit the 140mm: no i have seen a 160mm setup which mounted flush, had no adapter and seemingly could not use a 140mm rotor—guy had bought new levers w 140mm rotors supplied

dont think you’ll gain with the ztto, i have some -pretty sure they were worse than spyre’s, there is a better one available - -i’ll try & look up the brand tomorrow, do hope still make their variant it was excellent. i do have a trophy/rd lying around somewhere—want me to send it to you?

PS trust me on the compressionless, Adam at curve runs compressionless w trp spyre s on his monster cross with 600mm wide drop bars, it’s pretty expensive, most shops charge 20/metre

Cool. $20/m isn't too bad if the gains are like you say. The calliper presently is 160mm but I'm not sure if that 'plate' come off the bottom or not. I'll have more time on the weekend to check it out.

 

[Daniel Hale]

i’ll see if i can dig out the trp by/rd to send you, i’ve got a ztto in purple also
PS i remembered the name of the good add on hydro calipers, yokozuna...not only do they sound like cool japanese tech, they work yokozuna review here

 

[DMan]

i’ll see if i can dig out the trp by/rd to send you, i’ve got a ztto in purple also
PS i remembered the name of the good add on hydro calipers, yokozuna...not only do they sound like cool japanese tech, they work yokozuna review here

Cool. I actually read the Yokozuna reviews. Very nice gear, but pricey. I found Jagwire do a pro road kit with compressionless housing. Only $39 through Bikebug.

 

[leitch]

Cool. I actually read the Yokozuna reviews. Very nice gear, but pricey. I found Jagwire do a pro road kit with compressionless housing. Only $39 through Bikebug.

They look good for that price. I previously used the Nokon system on a CX bike with TRP mini-V brakes that were sensitive to cable tension and it really made a significant difference. For $40 that Jagwire is well worth a crack.

 

[Haakon]

In reality, a hydraulic line and system is just the levers and cables with 0 friction - its still x force applied at the lever to x force being applied to the pads.

Just the mechanical system has friction losses in the lever, the cable and the calliper mechanism itself. You'll never get that to zero, so hydraulic will always be better - but a really high quality cable and good routing sure does help.

On my hardtail the front BB7 cable had a clean single arc down to the calliper and it performed remarkably well - way better and way better feel/modulation than the rear with a longer and more convoluted cable.

 

[Calvin27]

the purist crew bag these brakes but i was surprised how well they feel, i had ridden a mates sworks tarmac hydro disc the week before, so had something to compare to but the giant system was every bit as good, lever feel was excellent.

I think it's the unfamiliarity that gets people. Can't juts rip it out easily and no idea abut servicing etc. From an engineering perspective it adds another link to the chain. Personally I am surprised that the thing would cost less than juts running full hydro.

On my hardtail the front BB7 cable had a clean single arc down to the calliper and it performed remarkably well - way better and way better feel/modulation than the rear with a longer and more convoluted cable.

Part of the problem is modern shifters force the cable to do gymnastics to get to the caliper. Then folks want to hide the cables under the tape and match the bar contours and all that. I had a hack SS drop bar build that used brake only levers and that thing felt better than all my other stuff. Keep it simple, direct path and little bends as large radius as possible.

 

[DMan]

Part of the problem is modern shifters force the cable to do gymnastics to get to the caliper. Then folks want to hide the cables under the tape and match the bar contours and all that. I had a hack SS drop bar build that used brake only levers and that thing felt better than all my other stuff. Keep it simple, direct path and little bends as large radius as possible.

That's the bugger though. Trying to route then as clean as possible. I'm going to try a pro kit and see if It makes a difference. The Jagwire review well.

 

[Calvin27]

The Jagwire review well.

Yeah I've been running jagwire stuff lol. Just make sure you cut the ends really clean - use a dremel.

 

[DMan]

Yeah I've been running jagwire stuff lol. Just make sure you cut the ends really clean - use a dremel.

The bike is currently running Jagwire as factory but I don't think it's the high end stuff. I have a good set of SS cable cutters...

 

[Flow-Rider]

Cool. I actually read the Yokozuna reviews. Very nice gear, but pricey. I found Jagwire do a pro road kit with compressionless housing. Only $39 through Bikebug.

We used to use the Jagwire compressionless outers back in the day with avid BB7's brakes and it worked pretty well. I can still remember doing some big descents at the Qld/NSW border ranges and the brakes stopped relatively well, it wouldn't be anywhere near the power of a four spot brake caliper of today but never had any near death experiences and some of it was quite steep.