Light Bicycle Carbon Rims/Wheels (Review Included on 1st Post))

[ChopSticks]

Ready to take the plunge into budget carbon wheels........ Light Bicycle

has any RB'er purchased rims or complete wheelsets from LB?

Can you please share your experience?
lead time?
shipping time?
Quality of packaging?
quality of built wheelset? (required truing/dishing?)
spoke choice?
claimed vs actual weight?

I'm well aware of the massive thread on MTBR re: LB....but wanted to pick RB'ers brains

During my research, I came across a thing called 'HOOKLESS'.
Seems like the latest craze in rims (not a new concept in itself) is 'hookless' rims, where the bead hook is removed completely to reduce weight, and the side walls are beefed up to produce more strength. Seems like a daunting idea that the tyre bead has no hook to 'grab' onto. Has anyone used hookless rims before? your views?




Review 27/06/14:

I did alot of research and ended up purchasing a complete wheelset from Light Bicycle, despite most RB'ers opting to purchase rims and building it locally/themselves.

Ordered:

26" 33mm AM Hookless Rims (UD Matte)
Bladed Pillar Spokes (Black)
Alloy Nipples (Black)
Hope Hub (40T, 32H, Black)

no decals, 15mm/12 x 142mm, and FULL UST/TLR

Paid on the 23/05/14, Posted on the 22/06/14, and arrived 27/06/14

Wheels were delayed by a few days due to the builder scratching the rim, and consequently a new rim had to be made.
I was informed UST wheels can only be built by the 'head' wheel builder... so hopefully it means a better wheel?

First impression:

I expected a bigger package (Like 2x separate boxes similar to Hope Hoops)

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Neatly Packaged (spare spokes and nipples wrapped and taped)​

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Expected abit more padding... but they arrived okay
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mhmmmm yum​

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black black black​

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Full UST/TLR = no more rim tape​

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bare wheelset weight: 1585g​

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SO MOTO!!!!​

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Wheels came in slightly heavier (1585g) than the quoted 1580g
I'm putting that down to the 'extra' carbon due to the UST rim build?

I weighed the old Hope/Flows(non ex) wheels before I sold them, and they came in at 1847g...

which makes a weight saving of 262g!




Problems/Issues:

Fit/Finish was superb... really happy with how they turned out.
I do however regret not getting the 3k finish.... (looked at JTmofo's wheels in the flesh and its alot more subtle than I expected, Joint of the 3k weave was hardly noticeable, even under sunlight/ right angle)

The Front wheel arrived with some rattling.... thought it was a loose nipple/spoke, but realised it was something in the rim.... after 15mins of trying to fish it out (such a pain given I only have the 1 valve hole due to TLR build) I finally got it with some double sided tape stuck to an allen key.
Looks like remnants of plastic bladder/resin?​

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I used my old/existing tyres (2.25 RaRa / 2.35 HD)
they were extremely tight, and given the carbon rims I was very gentle... but after 30 mins of babying the rims. I gave up and wrenched the shit out of them to get them on the rim!
Bent 2x Park Tool levers in the process.
NO damage/scratches to the rim whatsoever ! :whistle:

Rear set up perfectly fine, but the front has become a complete nightmare!

After fighting to get the tyre onto the rim (think I pinched/damaged the bead)
I added loads of suds and began to pump like a mad man!

Finally sealed.
and kept pumping, monitoring PSI (not to exceed 40psi) and waiting for bead to seat properly.
pumped one stroke at a time waiting for the final pop....

finally heard the 'ping' and a split second later....

BANG !!!!!

face/roof/car/work bench covered in semen.

floor pump only read 30-32psi before it gave way. (not sure how accurate the pump is though)
inspected rim for damage.... nothing I could see

Tried to re-seat the tyre, but gave up after 30mins.

Luckily I order a new tyre yesterday... so no riding my fancy new wheels until I get that tyre
and hopefully its easier to seat/seal !!!​

 

[tasty.dirt74]

Ready to take the plunge into budget carbon wheels........ Light Bicycle

has any RB'er purchased rims or complete wheelsets from LB?



Can you please share your experience? Found the transaction was a positive one. Quick email replies..Generally within a few hours..From transaction to delivery was less than 2 weeks, probably a few days less ..
lead time?
shipping time?
Quality of packaging? Cardboard box, some protection. Could have been better..
quality of built wheelset? (required truing/dishing?) has been retensioned once so far with about 150 klm on it. General XC ish trails.. Dirt roads..
spoke choice? This is the wheel build request that was requested of them..

"15 mm front hub, QR rear hub.

32 spoke Front and Rear. The rim Internal width is 23mm as per your previous email.

DT competition 2.0-1.8-2.0 spokes

Total amount is $486.5 + shipping cost $50= $536.5"

claimed vs actual weight?Actual weight of wheelset, no Skewer in rear wheel when weighed..1650grams.

I'm well aware of the massive thread on MTBR re: LB....but wanted to pick RB'ers brains... What you have read on MTBR is pretty much all you need to know. I say go for it.. Its $600 for a set of carbon rims.. They are very stiff, no lateral flex under hard cornering.. Hubs(novatec) seem good.. Not as per CK, Industry 9, but very good none the less. They are tubeless with a roll if Gorilla tape. Very happy with mine so far.!:thumb:

During my research, I came across a thing called 'HOOKLESS'.
Seems like the latest craze in rims (not a new concept in itself) is 'hookless' rims, where the bead hook is removed completely to reduce weight, and the side walls are beefed up to produce more strength. Seems like a daunting idea that the tyre bead has no hook to 'grab' onto. Has anyone used hookless rims before? your views?

Not sure on the theory behind this...Would think the "hook" can serve a fairly necessary part of the function of holding a tyre in place on a wheel.:faint2:??

10 char....

 

[Alo661]

http://www.rotorburn.com/forums/showthread.php?256458-Bead-hook-less-rims/

There's your hook-less discussion thread on here.

Personal opinion, if it's not used in Moto or any other type of wheeled racing, it's not going to be suitable for MTB.

 

[ChopSticks]

thanks tasty.dirt !

exactly what I wanted to hear. I'm pretty much 99% sold on these wheels!
Just want to confirm with Nancy if they offer Sapim CX rays, as I dont think DT Revs are strong enough...and dont really trust those pillar 1420's.
..... and if im forking out $$$ on a fancy wheelset. I want the best spokes I can get/afford.

There's your hook-less discussion thread on here.

Personal opinion, if it's not used in Moto or any other type of wheeled racing, it's not going to be suitable for MTB.

mustve missed that thread ! Thanks for the link mate !
fair point re: motor-sport application.
I know its used on some road car rims..... But will be interested to hear if any RB'er have had issues with their hookless rims on the trail.

 

[brisneyland]

thanks tasty.dirt !

exactly what I wanted to hear. I'm pretty much 99% sold on these wheels!
Just want to confirm with Nancy if they offer Sapim CX rays, as I dont think DT Revs are strong enough...and dont really trust those pillar 1420's.
..... and if im forking out $$$ on a fancy wheelset. I want the best spokes I can get/afford.




mustve missed that thread ! Thanks for the link mate !
fair point re: motor-sport application.
I know its used on some road car rims..... But will be interested to hear if any RB'er have had issues with their hookless rims on the trail.

ALL motor vehicle road, off road, and AFAIK truck rims are hookless.

I don't think my motorbike has bead hooks either (1992 XR600)

 

[ChopSticks]

Thanks for the clarification!

having said that..... How many bicycle tyres require a tyre press to install a tyre...... Really concerned how it will fair on the trail

 

[Quintin]

you are going to need a hook if you want to run tubeless?

 

[pharmaboy]

The hook seems to be more critical when the tyre runs flat - ie it stays on the bead so you can easily re inflate . Once up, the pressure holds the tyre there. Might be a useful idea might not be - specialized do it, not heard of many others though did get a giant OEM without bead hook in alu - I'm guessing that's to save money, not for any performance benefit.

 

[VTSS350]

you are going to need a hook if you want to run tubeless?

No.

I have 27.5 Light Bicycles hookless AM rims on my Carbine.

Just spent 7 days in Rotorua on them and didn't have any issues at all. We spent a couple of days just doing shuttle runs or tracks with heaps of berms and large jumps. Never burped them once.

The 33mm rim width gives a completely different tyre profile. The wide rim provides a lot more support than most rims and the tyre doesn't move/roll at all.

The rims are so good that I am going to give the downhill version a go on my M9.

 

[VTSS350]

The hook seems to be more critical when the tyre runs flat - ie it stays on the bead so you can easily re inflate . Once up, the pressure holds the tyre there. Might be a useful idea might not be - specialized do it, not heard of many others though did get a giant OEM without bead hook in alu - I'm guessing that's to save money, not for any performance benefit.

I put a new High roller II on backwards on only realised when I got to Rotorua. Pulled the tyre of the hookless rims and then seated it first go with 1 Co2 canister. I couldn't believe how easy it was!

Did 300k in 7 days, checked my tyre pressures every second day and never needed to add more air.

The hookless rim edge is thicker and will take more punishment before having problems.

 

[Nick_M2r]

Thread over on pink bike asking the same thing.

Second page is a bloke reporting on them, and he seems to have a very good knowledge of composites.

To sum it up, he said he is happy with what he payed for.
He says (and includes lots of pictures) that there seem to be quite a few flaws in the construction process, nothing major, but small things.
He says he trusts them, and in the end is happy with what he got for the price, but mentions that they are not Enve level quality.

http://www.pinkbike.com/forum/listcomments/?threadid=134008&pagenum=2

Examples he posted.

This is a small void on the edge of the rim, maybe 1.5mm in length

Interior shot of the rim showing the biax spoke bed. This appears to run from sidewall to sidewall it isn 't just the spoke bed area, more of a 30mm strip than a 10mm one. Fun ny they don't mention this, especially as it is how it should be.

Longitudinal strip that joins L/R side of rims and ties the sidewalls together. Looks a little sloppy, also a touch light on resin at the edge. The lack of resin fill indicates a less than optimal compression which will relate to the bagging fit.

A bit more pitting. These look like bubbles in the carbon, this implies not enough vacuum or mold pressure and potentially too high a resin viscosity, maybe cure temp issues.

Spot the weakest part of the rim. looking like a bit of clusterf_ck here. Lots of seams within a short area, most of them at 90 degrees to each other not bias cut into the cloth to give overlap. I'm guessing they rely too much on preforms when putting the rims together.

Regardless of all these issues, most of which aren't that great in the big scheme of things, I'm happy with the finished product and very happy with the weight and price. But knowledge is power, so i hope this helps people make more informed decisions.

Let's see how they hold up to some rock gardens and a good thrashing on their first ride tomorrow...

 

[Ivan]

The 33mm rims are looking very attractive.

 

[Jubas]

I ordered a set of the rims and built them up myself with DT Swiss 240s (QR/15mm) and Supercomps. After 18 months they're still running beautifully. I think i've had to re-true the front wheel once, but not the rear.. I'm fairly chuffed given it was my first wheel build attempt! I can't fault anything with the rims, although I do run them with the Bontrager Rhythm strip for a little added safety (and weight - an ok tradeoff imo)

 

[ChopSticks]

Awesme guys!

will def get a set of hookless 26 AM wheels in UD matte once they update their site (just started production of 26) and once I can confirm they build with Sapim xc rays

VTSS350:
Did you buy rims or complete wheelset from them? What spokes did you use?

 

[houli77]

i've got some LB Carbon rims arriving any day now.. Tracking says they are in Aust.

I read up heaps on them. Seems legit.

I ordered the DH version of the All mountain rim. I'm not too harsh on my rims, weigh only 73kg and feel like i've been running overkill with 823's tubeless for years.

Recently bought a 2nd hand 951 and the rims and hubs were not in the best shape. Was about to go the old hope hoops from crc and was scratching my head on rim choice when i noticed these, and the weight saving!

They actually emailed me the finished weights of the 2 rims i ordered, 437g and 434g vs 650+g for an 823....

luckily came across and bought some brand new hope hubs off farkin here, ordered spokes and nipples online.. hopefully be building them this weekend.

old rear hub is an sun ringle abbah/823/brass nipples so going carbon rims + hope pro 2 evo + dt comps with alloy nipples.. reckon i'll knock close to 700g out of my wheelset for almost the same price as what i would've paid for crc hope hoops with dh worthy rims..

So far their service and contact via email has been great. I ordered before chinese new year, for which they took off about 10 days holidays which i didn't know about. apart from that, their turnaround was about 2 and a bit weeks, and shipping is fast and tracked via EMS, 5-7days. I'm in no huge rush for them so the timeframe hasn't bothered me. my old rims are rideable. i'm heading to worldcups in cairns and taking dh bike so my main plan was to have them running and tested by then.

if i can be arsed i might take pics of the build and final weights and post it up..

 

[markb84]

Interested to hear how you go with this chops. Price of these is much easier to swallow than Enve. I'd love to drop some weight off my 823s.

 

[bgarry]

Got a set of 29er Carbon AM Rims from Light-Bicyle and had them built up on some existing hubs I had by Josh from XLR8Wheels .
Wheels are super stiff and still as true as the day I received them, I also had no issues setting them up tubeless - I'm close to 100kgs and they have taken a hammering with no issue.
I'll definitely buy another pair of the 650B rims when my Norco Range arrives.
I would also highly recommend Josh as a wheel builder... He will do the spoke spec and calc, and build them exactly to your requirements, he built mine with some nipple washers on the rear wheel as it’s a wise thing to do on carbon rear wheels when tensions get high. This dramatically reduces the likelihood of spokes pulling through the rim.

http://xlr8wheels.com.au/brendans-new-carbon-29er-hoops/

Regards,
Brendan

 

[ChopSticks]

Geyyyyyyy !!!
LB got back to me and said they don't offer Sapim CX-rays..... only DT Revs or Pillar 1420's.....

nor do offer brass nipples, only alloy (read some serious corrosion issues with carbon rims) so thats another turn off.

can anyone point me in the right direction on calculating the exact spoke lengths to have these rims:
http://www.light-bicycle.com/New-26...bon-rim-tubeless-compatible.html#.UwHHzSgmyJU

ERD: 518mm
laced to hope hubs in 3x (I assume this is the 'best' mtb pattern?)


I saw a thread on a guy special ordering a set of full UST LB carbon rims and painstakingly feeding the nipples through the valve hole, I'm happy to do that myself and lace up the hub.
Then get a pro to finsih the job...but I Dont want to spend $200~ on incorrect spokes. Can RB please help me out?

 

[eastie]

stop posting for 5 minutes and do it yourself.... try prowheelbuilder.com

 

[Ivan]

stop posting for 5 minutes and do it yourself.... try prowheelbuilder.com

:drum::high5:
Sapim also have a spoke calculator

http://www.sapim.be/spoke-calculator