swaz
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Wasn't directed at him
McFlow trails and the decreasing diversity of trails
- Thread starter Elbo
- Start date
jrewing
Eats Squid
I'm not a fan of most of the new trails being dumbed down.
I've done plenty of helping out for clubs and illegal trails.
I ride lots
So I'm now valid to comment- build more interesting stuff. It would be different to whinge if the trails were done by one or two guys in their own time.
I've done plenty of helping out for clubs and illegal trails.
I ride lots
So I'm now valid to comment- build more interesting stuff. It would be different to whinge if the trails were done by one or two guys in their own time.
Because I'm a moderator of the fucking website, mate. The owner of the website agrees with the way I see things and has elected that I assist in running the website thusly. Surely you grasp that.
Ky1e was going off a bit and leading a decent thread towards argument - I removed Shadow Puppet's post so it didn't spiral any further.
If you don't like that, your prob.
And Shadow puppet, you can also fuck right off it you don't like it here.
Simple, boys, like it or lump it.
shakes
Likes Dirt
When did mtber's become such whingers?
I love flow trails, especially the ones that the harder you push, the more sneaky lines open up to you, and the more you get out of it. The ones that it doesnt matter how fast you pedal you wont go any quicker unless your rolling and pumping and using all the features of the trail.
I can also take mates that aren't riders out on the same trail, know they wont be walking the whole way down and will come out or away with me again.
I get a similar feeling as catching a wave or getting a line perfect at the skatepark.
I can go ride somewhere new, and wont have to ride 3 loops at a snails pace before I'm aware of all the spots that will catch me out and smash me.
I do dislike when a few switchbacks are thrown in and they call the climb technical.
Much rather something that I need to be aware of pedal strikes, that I need to throw my hips about to get up steps or over boulders.
Not sure how you can say trails are less diverse. 20 years ago we had mostly fire trails and walking tracks with a few kickers off to the side.
Vic based, wombat was mostly 4wd and shared trails with moto riders plus a handfull of singletrack. Youies was barely legal, lysterfield definitely wasnt. Few things going on in warby etc that unless you were part of the crew you weren't a told of it's location.
Anglesea, forrest, you yangs, wombat, kinglake, lysterfield, red hill, buxton, lake mountain, buller, castlemaine, bright, dozens of other legalized area's I've missed... How is that not a good thing? All very diverse area's with their own characteristics and maps are easy to come by.. Previously you would of had to know someone who knew someone who could point you to a trail head.
I love flow trails, especially the ones that the harder you push, the more sneaky lines open up to you, and the more you get out of it. The ones that it doesnt matter how fast you pedal you wont go any quicker unless your rolling and pumping and using all the features of the trail.
I can also take mates that aren't riders out on the same trail, know they wont be walking the whole way down and will come out or away with me again.
I get a similar feeling as catching a wave or getting a line perfect at the skatepark.
I can go ride somewhere new, and wont have to ride 3 loops at a snails pace before I'm aware of all the spots that will catch me out and smash me.
I do dislike when a few switchbacks are thrown in and they call the climb technical.
Much rather something that I need to be aware of pedal strikes, that I need to throw my hips about to get up steps or over boulders.
Not sure how you can say trails are less diverse. 20 years ago we had mostly fire trails and walking tracks with a few kickers off to the side.
Vic based, wombat was mostly 4wd and shared trails with moto riders plus a handfull of singletrack. Youies was barely legal, lysterfield definitely wasnt. Few things going on in warby etc that unless you were part of the crew you weren't a told of it's location.
Anglesea, forrest, you yangs, wombat, kinglake, lysterfield, red hill, buxton, lake mountain, buller, castlemaine, bright, dozens of other legalized area's I've missed... How is that not a good thing? All very diverse area's with their own characteristics and maps are easy to come by.. Previously you would of had to know someone who knew someone who could point you to a trail head.
Last edited:
Funny, I was wondering just that myself....
Shadow Puppet
Likes Dirt
Calm down Johnny, as a moderator you come across as extremely unprofessional and if I'm being honest, a complete power tripping twat.
"If you don't like it, fuck right off"? I ended my post with a ;-P which generally means i'm having a bit of a go and a laugh at the same. Surely you've come across it before considering you're a 'professional' keyboard warrior?
Ky1e
Likes Bikes and Dirt
Dude, either post on topic or just shut up.
You can play your silly "I was just joking passive aggressive" shit all you want but keep in mind that I am not a professional, I'm a volunteer with no training at all. That means I make unprofessional decisions like banning people when they piss me off.
So please, for fuck sake, can just get back to talking about how the trail I like is better than the trail you like?
Shadow Puppet
Likes Dirt
While flow trail might be a small percentage of trails today, most trails now being built in bike parks are of the 2 meter wide, smooth gravel variety like copperhead. All I'm saying is that it's disappointing to see companies being paid good money come up with trails that are unimaginative.
Shadow Puppet
Likes Dirt
Well maybe you should hand in your gun......
I think we're pretty lucky in Canberra. Stromlo and Majura are built by companies however they are not gravel freeways, they're actually proper riding trails.
However I think the builders, whilst professional earthmover types they are riders and being directed by people like Rennie.
Don't hold your breathe!Well maybe you should hand in your gun......
*edit - :Banane24:
Last edited:
indica
Serial flasher
I love the trails here, 60 kms of track built by professional trail builders with a whole lot of "flow" stuff. Lots of ups and lots of downs.
All good stuff. There are even some rocky descents in there. And jumps. And black alternatives.
The trails would not have been made if "flow" could not be sold to people with money. We now have a trailhead, change rooms and pump track behind a pub in the middle of town. Not too far away is single track to the park.
Hand cut old school goat tracks could not bring that.
All good stuff. There are even some rocky descents in there. And jumps. And black alternatives.
The trails would not have been made if "flow" could not be sold to people with money. We now have a trailhead, change rooms and pump track behind a pub in the middle of town. Not too far away is single track to the park.
Hand cut old school goat tracks could not bring that.
Shadow Puppet
Likes Dirt
Flow trails here and there I have no problem with but the majority of trails these days seem to be (as you put it) gravel freeways. That's what I have an issue with.
Exhibit A:
Now I understand this is on a Green (Easy) trail but there is nothing natural about it at all. The cost that has gone into the landscaping could have been used in making a more interesting trail. Now Ive seen pictures of this section all over Flow MTB and Derby's website and they are very proud of it. Should mountain biking be proud of a trail that looks like its a path through a garden center. It might be a green trail but mountain biking is about skill (and improving on it) not riding a smooth bike path. Yes, it's only one section of a much longer trail but is this what we are telling newcomers to MTB that the sport is about? This is only one example but if you look at photos of most MTB parks these days, this is whats getting built.
It might only be a small percentage of trail now, but its gaining momentum and is a sign of things to come.
Exhibit A:
Now I understand this is on a Green (Easy) trail but there is nothing natural about it at all. The cost that has gone into the landscaping could have been used in making a more interesting trail. Now Ive seen pictures of this section all over Flow MTB and Derby's website and they are very proud of it. Should mountain biking be proud of a trail that looks like its a path through a garden center. It might be a green trail but mountain biking is about skill (and improving on it) not riding a smooth bike path. Yes, it's only one section of a much longer trail but is this what we are telling newcomers to MTB that the sport is about? This is only one example but if you look at photos of most MTB parks these days, this is whats getting built.
It might only be a small percentage of trail now, but its gaining momentum and is a sign of things to come.
FINX74
Likes Dirt
No matter what we build as professional trail builders - there will always be haters. The constrictions laid out on the projects from land owners are that intense I'm surprised sometimes we even get trail built. IMBA has been great for the sport but I believe we need to build above the guidelines here in OZ. A lot of IMBA stuff is great for the U.S. but crap for here in where most places are getting new trails... A lot of advocacy types want stacked loop etc very hard to do that with minimal trail marked for that area sometimes only 6kms max. and there are no mountains in and around Sydney with extremely sandy soils. The pro builders on here get it as they deal with both sides of the coin on a daily basis. Standards will be good for the industry no doubt, and I too am looking at it with other interstate pro builders. Small Trails have gone in some places and are well received amongst the landowners and most of the communities - now you will see actual bike parks built with the variations you seek within them. So everyone be happy we are moving forward...
#bringbackky1e
#bringbackky1e
That's a climb by the way mate, theyve just made getting up to where the fun begins as pleasant as possible, where a group of happy riders that enjoy being out can have a laugh and if anything like me and my riding buddies can slag each other from.the last descent or rev em up for the next, and the fact this pics been blasted all.over the internet says that's it's a poster posterchild for the professionalism behind trail building, one that will get shared amongst councils and governing bodies for a long time to come and help them be persuaded into the eye opening fact that more mountain bike trails, parks, venues or what ever they want to call it is a good thing, which no mountain biker with any sort of brain or love for riding their bike can complain about. Maybe I miss the point a bit because where I live we have trails coming out of our ears with a shit load of different styles to choose from so I might be over looking everyone else's point.
Last edited:
Shadow Puppet
Likes Dirt
That's exactly my issue with it! THIS is a 'posterchild' for the future of mountainbiking.
I have a plethora of natural trail at my doorstep (two blocks away) also and don't need to ride bike parks but it still worries me that this is what it's becoming.
What I'm getting at is that because of this what trail companies are doing there is a future for mountain biking, I like to think of the bigger picture where the door will be opened to bike.parks with all the steep blown trails you can.finger bang all day along with rolly trails you can loosen up and play around on, the other.option.is it all goes away and everyone.goes back to trying to have their secret spots, it sucks, a small group of us up here tried upkeep on an off the radar dh track and no matter what the more work people do the more people seem to come,and.they sure as shit ignore the giant painting of a shovel at the trail head that says D.I.G haha
thecat
NSWMTB, Central Tableland MBC
Sad thing is it has been us as a group who sold that philosophy to land managers.
I enjoy a nice flowy bermed up groomed trail but I still get most excited about stumbling across a random old trail out on and adventure ride. It doesn't have to lead anywhere. It can be stick strewn and rocky I still try and ride it as fast as as I can and check the reflexes (Which are getting slower)
As they say variety is the spice of life and we have to stop convincing land managers that big dollar machine built trails are the only suitable options. Mountain biking is suppose to be about getting out in nature, I'm not sure the manicured, artificially landscaped trails fit that bill. Sure there is a spot for them, but that's in urban centers with high traffic flows not dumped in the middle of the Aussie bush
We also need to convince newbies that getting off and walking over an obstacle never hurt anyone whose ego wasn't too precious to begin with and that falling off is part of the learning curve. Hell there's a bit of trail I went OTBs on at least a dozen times before for a managed to clear it. I learnt to roll. and now it's one of my all time favorite sections and I look forward to it ever time I start that trail. I haven't fallen off there for many years (touch wood) but it still scares me just that little bit as I head in and I still grin like an idiot when I make it through
Last edited: