Mt Coot-tha Forest - Mountain bikes eroding bush zone

Dhfactory

Likes Dirt
Mountain bikes eroding bush zone
By Brian Williams, heritage reporter
March 10, 2004

A CONSERVATION and community group has found the most extensive environmental damage done to Mt Coot-tha Forest is not from motorbikes or four-wheel-drives, but from mountain bikes.

It is estimated more than 2000 park visits occur each month by bike riders, although only the so-called downhill riders cause damage.

Countless illegal tracks wind through the dry eucalypt and rainforest patches on Brisbane's western edge, causing widespread erosion and silting of creeks in the steep shale country.

The Hut Environmental and Community Association yesterday called on the Brisbane City Council to stop downhill riders using the park.

Vice-president Rod Brown said it made no sense that the city's environmental levy was used to acquire parkland which was then torn up by bike riders and still more ratepayers' funds used to repair damage.

It was illegal to build tracks or ride vehicles in the forest and the BCC had enforced this in relation to motorbikes and 4WDs but had ignored mountain bikes.

So many mountain bike riders used the park that effectively parts had become bike precincts.

"Mt Coot-tha is an absolute maze of illegal tracks and eroded places," Mr Brown said.

His organisation had no issue with bicycles because they were mostly ridden at a leisurely pace on fire tracks but mountain bike riders went off-road.

"Mt Coot-tha is one of the city's best green areas," Mr Brown said.

"It would be far better to have bike riders moved to private property or an already degraded area."

Cr Helen Abrahams said she had inspected the damage and found it major.

Gillian Duncan, a spokeswoman for bike lobby group the Gap Creek Trails Alliance, said most mountain bike riders rode on relatively flat country in family or social groups and did no damage.

But downhill riding was fast and tended to cause erosion. About 100ha was needed for a couple of tracks for downhill riders.

"The fact is riders need somewhere to go," she said.

Ms Duncan said Mt Coot-tha was a suitable place, especially in the Gap Creek area, but the BCC had been too slow getting a management plan in place.

Conservationists had been asked to take part in preparing the plan but had declined.

"And now after the fact they come in, kicking up a stink," she said.

Cr Abrahams said she expected the draft plan to be implemented in about a month and it would allow bikes on fire tracks and provide a downhill section at Gap Creek.

Mr Brown said if mountain bikes were to be allowed, the least that should occur was that riders paid for the privilege so repair costs could be defrayed.

Cr Abrahams said the council would look at charging riders for rehabilitation.

Ms Duncan's submission to the management plan says a 2001 survey found that 375 riders visited the area, totalling 2200 visits each month.

About 200,000 bicycles were bought each year in Australia and of those more than half were mountain bikes.

The Courier-Mail



Fark i hate media.
 

toodles

Wheel size expert
What a load...

I personally don't mind paying for trail access but why should MTBers pay for trail maintainance if walkers don't? Walking trails are maintained by rangers paid by ratepayers - MTBers pay rates too.

Yeah there's erosion - what do you expect when anyone caught maintaining the tracks risks fines totalling thousands of dollars. At least MTBers are interested in maintaining the tracks. And "Widespread erosion"? I think someone needs to go see what widespread erosion actually looks like, and again the erosion that does exist would be prevented by proper trail construction and maintainance, something the BCC has prohibited.

And I think 2000+ bike riders (probably more IMO) should be considered a user group and have the privileges and input accorded to other users. Other users, who seem a lot less sharing than MTBers.
 

ELX

Likes Bikes and Dirt
Thats fucked. If they try to stop riders out there i persoanlly knowif they close down channel 10, engina ect i will be building illigal trails to downhill on. I dont give fuck there the most ignorant bunch of dickheads. If there so worried about erosion why cant they build us a montunbike park somewhere close to the city. Or give us say 4 trails on Cootha to ride and let us maintain them our
selves.
 

G-Man

Likes Dirt
Dhfactory said:
Mountain bikes eroding bush zone
By Brian Williams, heritage reporter
March 10, 2004

A CONSERVATION and community group has found the most extensive environmental damage done to Mt Coot-tha Forest is not from motorbikes or four-wheel-drives, but from mountain bikes.

It is estimated more than 2000 park visits occur each month by bike riders, although only the so-called downhill riders cause damage.

Countless illegal tracks wind through the dry eucalypt and rainforest patches on Brisbane's western edge, causing widespread erosion and silting of creeks in the steep shale country.

The Hut Environmental and Community Association yesterday called on the Brisbane City Council to stop downhill riders using the park.

Vice-president Rod Brown said it made no sense that the city's environmental levy was used to acquire parkland which was then torn up by bike riders and still more ratepayers' funds used to repair damage.

It was illegal to build tracks or ride vehicles in the forest and the BCC had enforced this in relation to motorbikes and 4WDs but had ignored mountain bikes.

So many mountain bike riders used the park that effectively parts had become bike precincts.

"Mt Coot-tha is an absolute maze of illegal tracks and eroded places," Mr Brown said.

His organisation had no issue with bicycles because they were mostly ridden at a leisurely pace on fire tracks but mountain bike riders went off-road.

"Mt Coot-tha is one of the city's best green areas," Mr Brown said.

"It would be far better to have bike riders moved to private property or an already degraded area."

Cr Helen Abrahams said she had inspected the damage and found it major.

Gillian Duncan, a spokeswoman for bike lobby group the Gap Creek Trails Alliance, said most mountain bike riders rode on relatively flat country in family or social groups and did no damage.

But downhill riding was fast and tended to cause erosion. About 100ha was needed for a couple of tracks for downhill riders.

"The fact is riders need somewhere to go," she said.

Ms Duncan said Mt Coot-tha was a suitable place, especially in the Gap Creek area, but the BCC had been too slow getting a management plan in place.

Conservationists had been asked to take part in preparing the plan but had declined.

"And now after the fact they come in, kicking up a stink," she said.

Cr Abrahams said she expected the draft plan to be implemented in about a month and it would allow bikes on fire tracks and provide a downhill section at Gap Creek.

Mr Brown said if mountain bikes were to be allowed, the least that should occur was that riders paid for the privilege so repair costs could be defrayed.

Cr Abrahams said the council would look at charging riders for rehabilitation.

Ms Duncan's submission to the management plan says a 2001 survey found that 375 riders visited the area, totalling 2200 visits each month.

About 200,000 bicycles were bought each year in Australia and of those more than half were mountain bikes.

The Courier-Mail



Fark i hate media.
Dude !!!!!

So over this land crap ..

Make us pay and we will !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
just stop complaining ..
We get fined for freeriding in the city ,, We get Fined for riding on some bush tracks ,, we get blamed for trail damage ,, the list goes on ...

personaly i thank the Bikers Expesialy the Downhillers :twisted:
as we wouldn't have a massive part of the land outside Waterfall / Engadine if it wasn't for a good Trail cut into the side of the hill that
the NSW bush fire bgd. created a firebreak out of and saved pretty much the whole area ..

SO..
my question is why not let us ride it heep trails accesable and useable by all ..
if QLD is anything like NSW the land will be swollowed up by development in time anyway so just use it ....

Catch yas G-man Outy
 

MrPlow

TMBC
Bloody DoGooders who have nothing better to do than cause trouble!
Get a life you greeny wankers.
When they practice what they preach and no longer drive cars, cause polution, contibute to effluant levels etc I will listen to them!
 

Ryan

Radministrator
Arrrrggghhh!!

Straight off the bat, I have a degree in Journalism but don't work in the industry because funnily enough, I hate journalists.

There's so much missing from this report that it's laughable and highly unprofessional to boot. Gillian Duncan has detailed environmental impact assessments on which tracks are actually sustainable and which ones do have erosion problems, no mention of that.

Internationally there are studies that show that downhill riding has a less deleterious effect on trails than horses or motos and a similarly deleterious effect to that of walkers.

'Countless illegal tracks'? Try 3. 2 of which are walking tracks originally built by the BCC, one of which was built my riders, the majority of which is on the road reserve, not a part of the forest reserve.

'Widespread erosion' from tracks that are mostly single track and 2 metres wide at the most? Right...

The real clincher for me though is "Vice-president Rod Brown said it made no sense that the city's environmental levy was used to acquire parkland which was then torn up by bike riders and still more ratepayers' funds used to repair damage. "

If the BCC would let us maintain the tracks, rather than fining the people they caught doing work this wouldn't be an issue.

The most infuriating part of this article is that he supplies not a single fact to back the Hut Environmental and Community Association's arguments, he's just presenting conjecture as fact to demonise our sport.

Fuck writing a letter, I'm going to call this Brian Williams character and see if he's interested in being educated in some of the facts of the matter, maybe even in actually reading some of the extensive documentation that Gillian Duncan has produced...
 

dvious

Likes Bikes
bloody tree huggin hippies... why dont they do something better with there time like actually mending the trails than complaining bout how were destroying the environment... mountain bikers are people too. dont we deserve a bit of respect.. its our country, our land and our right to use it.......
 

Cruz

Likes Dirt
These groups must love getting these reactions from mtbers and then use them as a response to others.
I can assure that these groups do follow these mtb sites for information.
Well written Ryan, let us know how you get on.
 

Sparkman

Likes Dirt
I also pay rates, so why can't some of my rates go into maintaining Mt Coot-tha's trails. As we all know, MTBers would maintain their own trails if they were allowed to. That's more than I can say for walkers, horse riders and the like.

What about the issue of use, at least MTBers like to get out and ride, keeping fit in the process. I see far more riders than walkers at Coot-tha.

It's also a blurry line between XC riders and DH riders. If you have a light but DH capable bike, then where do you draw the line? I can ride up the hills that I ride down. I can also play in the relatively flat XC tracks. Maybe they should fine riders for skidding and sliding....

As for eroded trails. Not all trails are badly eroded. For instance Hot'n'spicey is in great condition and seems pretty immune to DH riding. Deano's is probably one of the worst tracks for erosion. Ch10 is in pretty good shape over most of it. On the other side of the road, number 9 is badly eroded, but this seems to be mostly due to XC riders "making an easier line" down the hill. I like to ride straight down the guts, (which has looked the same for as many years as I have been riding). Poo shooter is reasonably well made and is in good condition, even after last years DH race. Letter box is pretty badly eroded, but that's not really a DH track and I suspect it's used more by XC riders slippin' and slidin' their way down.

I wonder what track the councilor visited? I suspect it was Deano's, which is reasonably accessible to someone wearing comfy shoes.

There are alot of MTB riders using Mt Coot-tha. You can't ban such a large user group. Instead, you can get together and try to manage the use of this resource. After all many of the riders are rate payers too. It may be that some tracks will have to be closed, but surely not all. I paid over $5000 for my bike and I'd like to ride it.

Of course, historically, Mt Coot-tha has suffered major environmental abuse. It used to be called one tree hill! You can't tell me that cutting all the trees down was conducted to prevent soil erosion. But that was then and this is now. I think level heads should prevail and solution with a few compromises should be found that will suit most people.

Maybe a DH action group should be formed. Gillian does an excellent job for XC trail access, but DH riders seem under represented. Given the number of shuttles that I see each weekend going up Coot-tha, there are plenty of DH riders using this resource. Maybe they should have a voice as well.
 

Ryan

Radministrator
Deano's should by all rights be closed down to riders, as much fun as it is it just gets more and more cut up every year and the fact we "can't" maintain it just makes it worse.

The fact that it finishes on a pretty popular walking track makes it worse again, the fact that the parts on the walking track are relatively unchallenging to most DHers and are therefore in general hit at flat-out-fuck-off-pedalling-your-guts-out speed makes it triply worse.

It's only a matter of time before a rider and walker have a serious coming-together on Deano's and when that happens you can bet our access to all of Coot-tha will become seriously restricted.

I'm sure the majority of riders would happily forfeit access to Deano's if the council would sign off on guaranteed access (and allow maintenance) to Channel 10 and Eugenia/Hot n Spicy/Original...plus I've only ever seen walkers once on Eugenia/Hot n Spicy/Original and never on Ch10 (probably because it isn't a walking track).

Just a warning to all Brisbane riders, now that the Coot-tha issue is in the media again expect the Ranger Danger meter to reach "Extreme" over the next few weekends, might be an idea to give the whole mountain a miss for a while.
 

tu plang

knob
i had a huge rant, but im not goin to bestoy it upon u now...
so all i have to say is they need to get together and come to an agreement of some sort. the council has to realise that banning mtbers isnt the solutions, that b/s article says the number of riders that use it and on how many occasions, how has the council got a hope of stopping mtbers (i know this sounds rebellious and isnt the sort of attitude that mtbers should project but its the truth, bans arent going to stop a lot of ppl) if they designated us some tracks and let us maintain those tracks everything would be fine...

hmmm looks like i just came up with another big rant in place of the last one... :)
 

Ryan

Radministrator
They've tried to stop us in the past, with big crackdowns, bulk fines and so on. The problem is the area is just too good to keep riders, and downhillers in particular away from.

Sealed road all the way to the top, plenty of parking / turnaround room at the bottom, 3 - 5 tracks to choose from (including original / hot and spicy endings to Eugenia and Bardon stairs / simpsons falls endings to Channel 10) all this just 15 minutes from the Brisbane CBD...
 

S.

ex offender
Land erosion and degradation? Tell that to the governments who sell thousands of hectares at a time, to developers who raze the lot and build wall-to-wall units across the lot. Arseholes.
 

tu plang

knob
Socket said:
Land erosion and degradation? Tell that to the governments who sell thousands of hectares at a time, to developers who raze the lot and build wall-to-wall units across the lot. Arseholes.
that was the topic of my original rant. i live near "the gully" u brisbaners may have seen it on the news a bit over a year back.... well its been cleared and filled and shit (despite the council having a shirtload of money to offer the developper [it was partly raised by the community]). neways 1 consolation is that heavy rain has fucked the whole site over a few times (it was a gully previously, its a fkin huge catchment too) and they havent sold a single block in the 6 mths or so theyve been on the market.
 

Kreaky

Likes Dirt
for fark sake, were all a bunch of normal guys, out trying to have fun. some people play footy or glof and they get a kick out of it the same we get out of riding. whats next people are gonna start trying to ban footy because they destroy the grass when the kick or skid to a stop, bloody hell! here in adelaide we have the same problem. theres a track on council property that the council knows of and have been letting us us it for years and now were getting fined if were seen on track just because there are some "RICH" people that live on the street we use to get to the track and thety dont like the look of groups of riders going down there street! I'm sure they wont like the look of graffity on there house if we had nothing to do! plus we have one of the best systems here in adelaide the hills are a 20 min train ride and another 20 mins to get to the top. Ride down catch the train back up ur not paying for the fueal of the car! And if there so "RICH" they should get a dick nothere head so people know who they are!
 

MTB_SYCO

Likes Dirt
hahaha man they are retards they dont realize that good downhillers wont skid as much as a crosscountry person when they ride slowly down the track and that even though we do rip up the tracks they obviously havnt look at this site and seen that we do get groups together to fix up the tracks, if they did close up these tracks at the moment and also charge for the use of mt cootha it was cause more damage then good i think because not all of us are rich after buying a pricy bike which would make us go off to different tracks (newly made tracks) by the way when was that document relised?
 

MTB_SYCO

Likes Dirt
they say they are waisting money on mt-cootha well wat about that fukin stupid walkin bridge across the river at indooroopilly now thats wat i call a waste of money i so make that they did alot more damage to the ground to wat we ever have done i think they should re-think wat they said
 

Sparkman

Likes Dirt
Deano's is probably the track that is attracting most of the attention. As Ryan said, it joins on to a popular walking trail. I've seen heaps of walkers on or near this track. The badly rutted section leading down to the final single track is easy to get to and makes the worst possible example of what DH riding does to the area. If you haven't noticed, it's right next to a creek, so examples of both erosion and silting can be pointed out to who ever is keen to listen. This is real bad.

I think that the local DH riders should consider giving up Deano's if that will allow access to other Coot-tha trails. I know we all love riding, but if we can't show that we are at least somewhat responsible, we'll all get shafted in the end and lose what is probably one of the most convenient riding areas anywhere in the world.
 

toodles

Wheel size expert
Just got a call from the reporter who did the story and he's doing a floow up and including some of the feedback he got from MTBers so I hope it turns out a bit more favourable.
 
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