Ourimbah trail access at risk

[gregh2810]

Notice to all MTB community members who use the trails at Ourimbah State Forest.
Recent discussions held with Authorities from State Forests have resulted in a situation that could jeopardise our use of the forest and associated lease to CCOMTB. At present the lease is under review and no future planning/development of Ourimbah trails will be considered till the issues raised are resolved. There are some issues related to safety and community concerns that as a club we are addressing to the best of our capacity, however, we are also seeking the support of the MTB community and all people who visit the trails.
PLEASE ... refrain from parking at the bottom of the hill and use the Trail Head parking area located just at the top of the first hill (where the trail-head sign is). We realise that this a little inconvenient for downhillers who exit from the forest at this point but we are pleading for your cooperation out of the seriousness of the issue. If you are there and you notice others parking at the bottom it would be of great assistance if you could mention this request to them also.
Also, we need people to be aware that the club’s lease on the land does not include permission to engage in night riding. We therefore do not endorse the use of the trails for night riding, and until something changes the club will be ceasing the inclusion of any night races.
Finally, please try to ensure that your activity while at the track is seen as community friendly and respectful. This includes being conscientious about litter, and obeying regular road rules (riding in the back of utes etc). We know that the vast majority of MTB riders are genuinely respectful community minded people and we hope these issues can be resolved without affecting our sport. It would be a terrible situation if our access was denied and as a result other people who try to restrict riding came in and sabotaged the trails, bridges, fixtures etc that we have worked hard on developing over many years.
Greg Holmes
On behalf of CCOMTB club committee

 

[3viltoast3r]

Just out of interest, what are the exact issues that are of concern?

Also, posting this in 12 forums across this board is going to hamper discussion efforts..

 

[mullan2304]

The area has been signposted as no parking for most of the year. Basically, if you can see the house at the bottom then you shouldn't be there.

Go up the hill and park in the newer cleared area that gets used for marshalling club rounds.

We realise that this a little inconvenient for downhillers who exit from the forest at this point but we are pleading for your cooperation out of the seriousness of the issue

It's not just downhillers champ. Every time I've been there it would be a 10 to 1 ratio of xc to downhillers parked there.

 

[THE Manik Man]

In short for those who cant read, there are OTHER people who use and live by the park and there experience in the park is being impacted on by what we as mountain bikers are doing.

so please:

1. do not use the bottom car park (espically where old mates gate to his poperty WITH THE SIGNS NO PARKING)
2. do not use the bottom car park for DH shuttle pick up
3. do not ride in the back of ute or trailers as it is a public road where normal road rules apply
4. try not to colin mccrea your car up and down the mountain
5. try not to leave any rubbish

From what i understand is the resident living next to the bottom car park is the one of the main sticking points (as he is probably the person most effected by our use of the park), if we can refrain from using the bottom car park he has no legitament complaint and this will go along way to ensuring we can continue our use of the park

 

[nitrous to burn]

It's not just downhillers champ. Every time I've been there it would be a 10 to 1 ratio of xc to downhillers parked there.

I completely agree with this. I have been there only once in the past year and each time waiting for shuttle to the top i hae seen the cars with cross-country parked at the bottom.

What safety issues are we talking about? Like jumps being too big, unsustainable structures, just the unsafe enironment of mountain biking and the fact the state forest doesn't want to be sued even though we hae liability forms to sign?

And what else can the mountain bike community do to help?

Cheers.
Tom.

 

[Nerf Herder]

Quick question:
Does this no parking also mean no shuttle pickup and turn around ??

I've been looking at the signage and I think its a little misleading
i) the no standing signs are obvious ... but where all the people park there are no signs except for the [P] and I think there is a arrow pointing up the road.
ii) The worded sign says " ... do not park near this sign" [para-phrasing] it doesn't say, park up the hill, or don't park within "X" meters of this sign

I said this in the other thread several months ago ... but I think the club needs to put a big wopping sign " The CCOMTB Club and Committe advise all riders to park at the trail head up the hill "X" meters further up the dirt road ... failure to follow these simple instructions will lead to the loss of the Club's lease and closure of the track. DO NOT PARK within 500meters of this sign [Fuck Yas - optional]"

It's not just downhillers champ. Every time I've been there it would be a 10 to 1 ratio of xc to downhillers parked there.

I agree, the vast majority of people I see parking down the bottom are XCérs and a large number of locals. The cars block the way of the horse transport trucks and they spend alot of time doing 10 bazillion point turns.

I've been doing mid weeks and there is surprisingly a large number of quick lappers hitting the XC loop up and parking down the bottom.

Similarly on a recent weekend, there were a few DHérs (out of towners based on discussions) and they parked down the bottom. but the majority were XC'ers

I have asked a few people to move, but I get strange looks (as if, whats this out of towners trying to tell me to move for ...)

You need more explicit signage, and from a political point of view, you need to show your stakeholders your doing something, other then posting on a forum, that not everybody is on (especially XC'ers)

Apologies for pointing fingers and creating a "them and us" vibe ... but I'm telling you what I'm seeing.

 

[MATTY R]

I agree. A big sign that clearly states "do not park here" rather than the small no standing signs. Not everyone that rides is on rotorburn or looks at the club website.

Also what about Sticking a Letter at the trail head Hut explaning what is happening I'm sure everyone would happily park at the top if they knew how serious the situation was.

 

[bighitben]

[*]do not use the bottom car park for DH shuttle pick up

Firstly i'm not trying to argue (if the State Forests are specifically requesting it then thats fair enough and i understand) but considering the trail is very pedally and tiring, added that you have to push/ride back to the shuttle pickup, then pushing up the hill after each run to meet at the top carpark for shuttles is extremely exhausting. That area is used during races for a shuttle pickup zone, so im just asking to clarify if we can use it on regular weekend rides like on a race day for shuttles, because i would like to follow the rules but this would be a big set back.

 

[sammydog]

We have been monitoring this from a distance with the Awaba lease as we deal with the same Forest NSW staff with our operational permit.

Its a shame that the minority of riders are again flaunting the rules to bugger it for the larger bike community.

The parking is a no brainer if you ask me. Park in the designated parking area. Lets not get into a DH v's XC mindset, the onus is on all of us to educate those doing the wrong thing by the Central Coast club.

We are in the same situation with night riding at Awaba and are currently trying to resolve the issue, fortunately for us we have a bigger bush buffer to neighbors. It would be good to see people respect the CCOMTB's wishes though and stay away at night for the time being.

A lot of these principles though, like leaving the place clean, respecting the area and its neighbors, respecting road rules are really common sense things that we should all be doing where ever we ride. Sad that some people just can't help themselves.

Firstly i'm not trying to argue (if the State Forests are specifically requesting it then thats fair enough and i understand) but considering the trail is very pedally and tiring, added that you have to push/ride back to the shuttle pickup, then pushing up the hill after each run to meet at the top carpark for shuttles is extremely exhausting. That area is used during races for a shuttle pickup zone, so im just asking to clarify if we can use it on regular weekend rides like on a race day for shuttles, because i would like to follow the rules but this would be a big set back.

It may be tiring to get back up to the carpark, but the alternate is no trail. You won't be puffed then.

 

[gixer7]

It's not just downhillers champ. Every time I've been there it would be a 10 to 1 ratio of xc to downhillers parked there.

I don't think the OP was blaming downhillers for any of the current issues but was merely stating that he understands parking up the hill is more inconvenient for those with heavier rigs. Please read what is written before getting hot under the collar.

I really don't think this thread should turn into a finger pointing exercise.

I've passed this info on to as many people as I can - hopefully the word gets out.

 

[outtacontrol]

As a visitor to this network back in May, it would be a tragedy if this trail was lost. We rode at Stromlo, Majura and Wingello and I rated this trail the sweetest of them all.

By the sounds of it, the house at the bottom of the hill is where the problem lies. Perhaps if someone approached him to discuss his concerns and showed that the club was responsible ands willing to address his concerns, it could help to bring a positive outcome.

And besides, what would become of Bob???

 

[frdlvr]

I love the track and ride up there as often as I can and would be sad to see us losing it.

But I see 1 thing that could lose the track for us and that is the state DH round being held there again.

The amount of people that come for it and the lack of parking when you take away the bottom section could be our downfall.

BUT in complaint with the owner of the property at the front, the problem only started when he made a new paddock for his horses and added in the 2 access gates for them in the old established parking areas. Also the road when you go past his property is as bad as ive seen it, so are the forestry department giving him notices to fix the road after all the damage he has caused... I guess that has been over seen and getting rid of the mountain bikers is the main priority.

 

[jrewing]

It sounds like the guy at the bottom is out to get us...when i'm there the majority does the right thing in regards to the OP. they're will always be the odd person breaking the rules, knowlingly or not, and it only takes one person/group to give ammo to Ol' mate down there, then everyone/Mtbr's as a whole are tarred with the same brush.
So are we screwed ultimately?

The problem with the parking at the bottom happens at the last run when riders park there to hasten their getaway home. So a big sign will help no doubt. and will go someway to looking proactive

 

[3viltoast3r]

Now just out of interest, not to cause a shit-storm or anything, but what is particularly wrong with the nose-in parking to the opposite side of the road to "Old mate's" house?


Also what's the clubs stance RE the shuttle pick-ups at the bottom? Surely that would just be a case of whingers will whinge..

 

[Tomas]

Now just out of interest, not to cause a shit-storm or anything, but what is particularly wrong with the nose-in parking to the opposite side of the road to "Old mate's" house?


Also what's the clubs stance RE the shuttle pick-ups at the bottom? Surely that would just be a case of whingers will whinge..

It doesn't matter if old mate has a justifiable issue with it or not, it only takes one pissed off resident to kick up a shitstorm. Someone offer to mow the mans lawn every second week if thats what it takes to keep him happy.

 

[@nDr3w]

I really don't think this thread should turn into a finger pointing exercise.

I do, see below:

By the sounds of it, the house at the bottom of the hill is where the problem lies.

Now just out of interest, not to cause a shit-storm or anything, but what is particularly wrong with the nose-in parking to the opposite side of the road to "Old mate's" house?

Too much dust, noise, or some other bullshit. There were no problems until the new folks moved into that house, then all of a sudden a whole lost of new changes and new regulations were forced upon the club. Simply a case of one persons stupidity (in the sense that they knew where they were moving to) and selfishness is ruining it for everyone.

 

[gixer7]

I do, see below:




Too much dust, noise, or some other bullshit. There were no problems until the new folks moved into that house, then all of a sudden a whole lost of new changes and new regulations were forced upon the club. Simply a case of one persons stupidity (in the sense that they knew where they were moving to) and selfishness is ruining it for everyone.

I don't know how constructive that ^^ is but I meant finger pointing as in XC riders blaming DH riders and vice versa.

As far as residents making complaints I agree it is small minded but that is the reality we have to deal with unfortunately.

 

[sammydog]

\
Too much dust, noise, or some other bullshit. There were no problems until the new folks moved into that house, then all of a sudden a whole lost of new changes and new regulations were forced upon the club. Simply a case of one persons stupidity (in the sense that they knew where they were moving to) and selfishness is ruining it for everyone.

There is more to it than just the neighbor here.

Forest NSW are really cleaning up the OP system and putting tighter controls on a lot of things like trail construction, events and neighbor relations.

We actually went through a similar issue 5 years back with the Amazon trail and its why it closed and we moved to construct Monkey.

End of the day, anyone on any property has the right to not be adversely impacted upon by adjoining land uses where reasonably possible. In this case the impacts can be managed to the point that they are not an issue, so whats the problem with complying with Forest NSW requests.

Getting along with the neighbors is a two way street and I think in this instance its not too much of an imposition to park up the hill and not leave a mess.

 

[gregh2810]

Some clarification....
I had no intention of implying that DH’ers were the target of this topic over XC’ers. Blame is not being laid here. We too see that many XC riders park at the bottom, and gixer7’s reasoning about the weight of DH rigs and getting them back up the hill was spot on (thanks Gixer).
Apologies for multiple posts across forums but the priority was to avoid missing people who are selective about their viewing.
Safety issues referred to do not relate to riding or the track. State Forests cannot be sued for MTB injuries and this is not a concern to them. The issues are typically surrounding community member’s views and subsequent reporting of concerns they see on the road and in the car parks. Ute surfing and the ‘Colin McRae’ syndrome as Manikman suggested are examples of concern. We know there are other people up there being irresponsible who are not MTB’ers however we seem to be copping the brunt of the blame. It is a shared public rd with horse riders, walkers, etc, and our profile up there is dominant.
Better signage will be placed both at the lower car park and at the trailhead sign very soon. It is now a committee priority and part of our response strategy to State Forests. We hope that Vandals are less successful than they have previously been and we will do all we can to place signs beyond reasonable reach.
The issue of shuttling and the clubs policy will need to be a topic for discussion at a club meeting. Presently our request is to refrain from parking at the lower area. Personally (not as a committee rep) I think that if you’re simply picking up and driving away then it shouldn’t be a major problem, but if you can avoid shuttling from down there it can only help our cause.
Some response posts have mentioned a particular neighbour and tried to paint a clearer picture about the reasons for these issues coming up. Please understand that this is not the entire scenario and there are multiple stakeholders contributing to the bigger picture that is involving State Forests. By no means do we want the neighbours subjected to uninformed or inaccurate reports, and this forum is not the place for elaboration about the specifics of the issue. People are welcome to come to club meetings to gain further insight if they desire. In the meantime the best support we can receive from people is to communicate our needs to others and be sensitive to the issues presented.

 

[@nDr3w]

There is more to it than just the neighbor here.

Forest NSW are really cleaning up the OP system and putting tighter controls on a lot of things like trail construction, events and neighbor relations.

We actually went through a similar issue 5 years back with the Amazon trail and its why it closed and we moved to construct Monkey.

End of the day, anyone on any property has the right to not be adversely impacted upon by adjoining land uses where reasonably possible. In this case the impacts can be managed to the point that they are not an issue, so whats the problem with complying with Forest NSW requests.

Getting along with the neighbors is a two way street and I think in this instance its not too much of an imposition to park up the hill and not leave a mess.

That's a fair point, and I completely agree about it being extremely easy and simple to just park up the street and not make a nuisance. That said, I maintain my point that there weren't any major issues involving neighbours up until recently, and having had the mispleasure of talking to them previously, their attitude isn't doing us any favours. That, and the point you made about property owners having the right not to be adversely impacted (however minorly) leads me to believe that if they want riding to cease, then we don't stand much of a chance.