Plastic bags, climate change, renewable energy,

Calvin27

Eats Squid
I'd like to see some actual scientific evidence that shows the policy has a net environmental benefit. The wording on colesworth sites are flaky as hell (pretty much an 'opinion' that it's better). You'd think that with the projected $70m they each stand to profit from that they could at least back this up with some sort of research/evaluation even if it is funded with vested interests.
 

droenn

Likes Bikes and Dirt
TBH, I'm not really sure of the motivations or efficacy of the coles and woolworths move away from plastic bags. I'm just concerned with the use of plastics in general and why its necessary to justify their use at a personal level. As I said, I moved away from single use bags ages ago, so the move by the large supermarkets to switch now is kind of irrelevant to me, so I'm not defending them at all - just questioning the resistance from consumers.

My concerns are with depletion of resources (and biodiversity) through consumption and pollution. Plastics do a good job of this in both regards. Plastics themselves aren't the culprit though - like has been said, if used properly they make a lot of sense and provide us with manufacturing options we simply can't get from other materials. However, there are simply too many irresponsible humans and companies that are content with shirking responsibility for their use and they do end up in natural systems. The more single use plastics we take out of the equation, the less there are for idiots to release into the environment, and the less ending up in landfill - which is not as much "out of sight, out of mind" as we like to think.
 

safreek

Vealcake
Dozer has the right idea, give your dog a feed of Aussie strawberries, help Australia, your dog will thank you as well.
Why do woolies and Coles get them packed in plastic though, being the world saviors with the bag ban, bet them packages could choke more animals and trap them so they starve to death than a bag
 

pink poodle

Our man in Japan
I ride to the shops...I put my groceries in my back pack...I ride home. You guys are all just killers. You May as well be out there hunting whales.


Damn my fact smells good.
 

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie

ozzybmx

Likes Bikes and Dirt
7.6 Billion people in the world, Aus has 24 mill... less than the population of Shanghai. I would love to think that if we all did something, it would matter but in reality, having the whole of Aus, being under 3% of the worlds people, if even 10% of that 3% cared, it would be a start.

In reality, its a case of CAN YOU AFFORD TO BE PLANET KIND, sadly it costs more to be kind to the planet and the fuckwits who preach this shit,who make it more expensive for everyone.
 

Freediver

Likes Bikes and Dirt
I can't believe how many selfish stupid cunts there are on here. I guess it comes from reading Murdoch's' crap. I am so sick of this "We are only a small country, it's not us it's them" attitude. On a per capita basis we are 7th worst in the world for CO2 emissions and that is before we count our coal exports. Our oceans and rivers are fucking full of plastic but I guess the bags caught in the trees along the Yarra from the recent high water came from China and the plastic that lines Port Phillip Bay came from Indonesia.
We are amongst the worst offenders on a per person basis. Wake up.
 

pink poodle

Our man in Japan
I can't believe how many selfish stupid cunts there are on here. I guess it comes from reading Murdoch's' crap. I am so sick of this "We are only a small country, it's not us it's them" attitude. On a per capita basis we are 7th worst in the world for CO2 emissions and that is before we count our coal exports. Our oceans and rivers are fucking full of plastic but I guess the bags caught in the trees along the Yarra from the recent high water came from China and the plastic that lines Port Phillip Bay came from Indonesia.
We are amongst the worst offenders on a per person basis. Wake up.
Yeah but look at everywhere else that slightly justifies this position...it's looks so dirtier than dirt and helps us feel better about consuming. As long as I don't need to change my habits I'm happy. Your fake news just makes me feel guilty and ineffective.
 

Dozer

Heavy machinery.
Staff member
Our oceans and rivers are fucking full of plastic but I guess the bags caught in the trees along the Yarra from the recent high water came from China and the plastic that lines Port Phillip Bay came from Indonesia.
We are amongst the worst offenders on a per person basis. Wake up.
Again, that is purely because "stupid cunts" can't put there rubbish in the bin. The plastic isn't constructed with a brain that enables it to seek a water source once a human has handled it.
And the coal mine thing? You reckon all the people labouring in that industry would prefer to live unemployed and in poverty just to save the planet in 3,000,000 years from another ice age? It amazes me that people have the nerve to attack a worldwide industry that provides so much to so many people and suggesting otherwise is so unrealistic.
 

droenn

Likes Bikes and Dirt
3 million years? Mate, we're in the middle of it now. Its called the Anthropocene.

We also need to move away from the mentality that jobs = purpose = necessary for everyone. That era is passing to. But thats a whole different discussion about technical disruption and basic incomes etc.
 

redbruce

Eats Squid
I'd like to see some actual scientific evidence that shows the policy has a net environmental benefit. The wording on colesworth sites are flaky as hell (pretty much an 'opinion' that it's better). You'd think that with the projected $70m they each stand to profit from that they could at least back this up with some sort of research/evaluation even if it is funded with vested interests.
http://www.deakin.edu.au/research/research-news/articles/plastic-bag-ban-not-as-simple-as-it-seems
http://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2018-04-18/plastic-bans-what-you-need-to-know/9653504

Getting all worked up over who's making money out of this, there may be no "I" in team but so what, and other conspiracy theories is missing the point.
http://www.abc.net.au/ourfocus/waronwaste/

Single use bags is just the tip of the problem iceberg but its got to start somewhere. Agree evidence based policy is crucial.

If nothing else the "bag ban" has been a flag waver and this discussion is one of many as a result. That's a good thing.
 
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Dozer

Heavy machinery.
Staff member
Goddam Dozer - seriously, your "coal employs people so it must stay" comment is beyond ludicrous.
You obviously don't understand the climate change situation we are charging headlong into.
I'm not trying to ruffle feathers or come across as an uneducated gimp and you're right, I don't have a degree in what is going on with climate change but I get the basic science behind it and it frightens the shit out of me. I've pointed out that I do more to make an effort to look after what we have but I'm bloody realistic about; changing things in my life to live like a neanderthal isn't how I want to live my life. Examples of that? I'm gonna spend a shitload of money on good seats on a plane to fly to Canada to ride bikes, I'm gonna take flights to watch motor racing around the world, I'm gonna ride bikes and do massive hikes in New Zealand, I'm gonna drive all over Australia helping out at races and riding, building trails with mates etc etc. I work bloody hard to earn some of the great pleasures I work towards and that comes from a good income in a good industry. It also feeds my family and allows us to live in a big beautiful luxurious home near the sea surrounded by good working people.
I'm not attacking you guys with what I say though, we're in here discussing this stuff and all input is welcome. I'm trying not to justify my opinion on it as I couldn't care less what people assume I do is wrecking the planet but I am going to dig my heels in and say again that I make more of an effort to look after what is around me than most people I know. I do also look after what I have in my own toy box too and I'm not keen to change it and miss out on seeing and experiencing what we have.

Edit: I'm not in the coal industry but I am in an industry that provides resources to that and most; actually EVERY place of employment in Australia, big picture terms of course.
 

hifiandmtb

Sphincter beanie
Understanding climate change should be one of the most important things we do. Simple as that.

It will open your mind to having a truer understanding on our impact on this planet. Individually & collectively.

BTW, if climate change impact was included in your airline tickets, you couldn’t afford to fly.

Here’s that graph again:

 
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Flow-Rider

Wheel size expert
Goddam Dozer - seriously, your "coal employs people so it must stay" comment is beyond ludicrous.

You obviously don't understand the climate change situation we are charging headlong into.
Honestly you need take a good look in the mirror, how can you possibly justify what your saying if you think that you don't impact in this world environmentally. If you really gave a fuck about it like you think you do, you would start by not using energy thirsty equipment like mobile phones and computers as they waste energy just for your pleasure and give your job up at the same time because that impacts on the environment too.

When you go and live off the grid like one of those hippies in Byron bay then I'll take my hat of to you. If you don't want to give up all the comforts of life to save the planet then you're obviously full of it. You've got to be able to live and see past your own finger pointing because most of these holes in the ground exist because they feed industries that require fuel to operate, if no one bought the products they made from it, there wouldn't be a need for their existence. No body needs to live a luxurious life but that's our choice to do so in this world.
 
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