Reduced numbers in XC/marathon events? Why?

[rsclio]

All of the above

A lot of the factors that have been mentioned are valid ones.
I'm in a reasonably fortunate position in that my sons particularly the older one are into bikes so there are fewer conflicts these days.
We had 3 entries in the Yowie on Saturday and all had a ball including the 13yo who couldn't wait to get into the Yowie suit after his 15km race!
So entries for the day for us was a reasonably $80
The last few years we had done Bike Buller but I think next year will not be a goer as If I look at the events the boys and I are looking at doing it would be $600 + in entry fees alone.
Think we will stick to club racing as much as possible especially with 3 or 4 entry fees.
What people are saying about age of riders also strikes home a bit spending a lot of time riding with 14 & 15 year olds.
XC just is not as cool as Enduro or DH in the eyes of some of these young guys.
We lucked into joining GMBC just before they started up their young guns program which has over the last year seen a core group of young guys go from strength to strength. I know of a couple of other clubs who run junior programs but not really too many that I know of. I think the clubs who do this will be around for the long run.

 

[Calvin27]

I'm in a reasonably fortunate position in that my sons particularly the older one are into bikes so there are fewer conflicts these days.
QUOTE]

Lucky man - you should convince them to do a 24 hour race or something. A family team would be cool as!

 

[rsclio]

The youngest has just turned 13 so can just do some racing now - I plan to get us in a team for the crazy 6 next year something I have wanted to do for a long time

 

[Fifteen.Hundred]

Cost, distance, choice and value for money are all relevant to me also. I much prefer the 3 hour marathon races in and around Melbourne run by clubs. The entry fees are more reasonable and having a young family, the later start times are appreciated. Races like the Otways & Wombat are costly and logistically rather difficult.

I wonder if a simpler centrally controlled and ability based A,B,C,D… category system for regular racers might assist in boosting numbers. Yeah I know, too hard to implement & maintain…

Handing over race entry fees with next to no chance of ever getting anything to show for it wears thin after a while.

 

[mmatrix]

MISS WESTgate critts.

i generally really enjoy racing once a week after work either at no frills or west agate dirt crits.

having a regular hit out keeps me in shape and i also catch up with mtes and plan a weekend ride.
since Westgate has finished I've found it hard to get fit so therefore don't feel like entering a race. And hanging out for no frills to start.

When i race once a week, during the week , I'm more in the zone for other races and also just need one other 1.5 hour ride during the week to stay in shape.

but my work life is very unstructured, AS often can't ride for weeks on end due to work and work travel. Im in Arizona now, haven't been on a bike for 4 weeks.

 

[Calvin27]

Handing over race entry fees with next to no chance of ever getting anything to show for it wears thin after a while.

Like I said, jersey, socks, whatever lol.

Seriously though there needs to be heap better coordination. I mean if the whole MTB scene got itself together you could make it stick really well. Comparing to my local tennis comp here are some ideas:
- Frequent events (maybe weekly/fortnightly) at alternating venues where the 'home club' coordinates and provides support. Higher frequency means we move from a single event outcome to a rolling year meaning better participation. Given most of us ride frequently this would work well. I mean all other sports have a weekly format so why not MTB?
- Include online database of event times and stats etc. people can go check out their scores, rivals and see if they were racing next week. This is a biggie and really nice thing we have in tennis - it means you start being more involved and strategizing how to beat the other dude.
- Change from simple club memberships to integrated memberships and provide above services.
- Coordinating the whole thing means more sponsors, freebies and the like.
- Move to an annual membership - maybe $500 for lite (5-8 events) medium(8-12) and heavy users (unlimited). Membership gets you a kit (with help from sponsors of course).
- With numbers up and participation higher, grades can be implemented meaning people get a bigger chance at winning something even if it is just a small medal - it's a nice touch and encouraging.
- Throw in some off record events like chilled ride days, point to point rides and awards events or something.
- Maybe even add some club challenges like a tag team with one or two people from each 'grade'. This will bolster the club membership and ignite some competitive spirit at all levels. We used to do this for martial arts and it was fun switching from two 7 year old beginners to national champions on the same team. Brings a family element to it too.

Even though I don't race, I'd buy into this format. The current line up is either bucket list type events or hardass mtbrs that have no relevance to average Joe. After you've done it there is really no incentive to go back again unless you are a more committed racer. To go bigger, you need more buy in from average riders, not just the top end.

 

[silentbutdeadly]

Comparing to my local tennis comp here are some ideas:
- Frequent events (maybe weekly/fortnightly) at alternating venues where the 'home club' coordinates and provides support. Higher frequency means we move from a single event outcome to a rolling year meaning better participation. Given most of us ride frequently this would work well. I mean all other sports have a weekly format so why not MTB? We do monthly
- Include online database of event times and stats etc. people can go check out their scores, rivals and see if they were racing next week. This is a biggie and really nice thing we have in tennis - it means you start being more involved and strategizing how to beat the other dude. Got that
- Change from simple club memberships to integrated memberships and provide above services. ditto
- Coordinating the whole thing means more sponsors, freebies and the like. ditto
- Move to an annual membership - maybe $500 for lite (5-8 events) medium(8-12) and heavy users (unlimited). Membership gets you a kit (with help from sponsors of course). Annual membership is $32, annual race fees are $50 (plus MTBA membership and plus annual Enduro). Club kit (jersey & hoodie) is extra
- With numbers up and participation higher, grades can be implemented meaning people get a bigger chance at winning something even if it is just a small medal - it's a nice touch and encouraging. three grades men,two grades women, two kids grades plus combined points for club champion (who this year will be aged twelve due to him turning up to every race and winning most of them in his grade - WOOT!) and there's a separate 4 race summer series (short course) with similar grades
- Throw in some off record events like chilled ride days, point to point rides and awards events or something. Yep - two official events and plenty of socials plus AGM/awards
- Maybe even add some club challenges like a tag team with one or two people from each 'grade'. This will bolster the club membership and ignite some competitive spirit at all levels. We used to do this for martial arts and it was fun switching from two 7 year old beginners to national champions on the same team. Brings a family element to it too. Roll of the Dice - one 2.5 km lap each for pairings from across grades over 1.5 hours with each rider rolling dice at lap completion for a lap score. Team with highest score at the end wins $300 2nd $200 3rd $100 - and it has never been won by the pairing with the most laps!

Mind you all this can only be achieved by a dedicated club committee with incredible social support - hard to get such a thing like this in the city

 

[Cúl-Báire]

I think the logistics of getting to / from races is a big factor, particularly if they aren’t offering particularly good value to begin with.

Even if the race is close to home you still take the bike, tool box, esky with, water food, etc… I am lucky the You Yangs is only 5mins from me but it still involves packing the car (coz I am a lazy bastard); if the races are further away generally it involves taking more, and if an overnight stay and heaven forbid kids are involved it becomes a real battle to get shit together for just a race, particularly if like me you are a punter. The costs add up quite quickly, and when you get little to show for it people might well be a little reluctant to make the effort.

The Vic Enduro Series and by all reports events like Maverick Series, and Choc Foot Series have done well because they are just that, a well-run series of events and that in part is responsible for bringing riders back for the next event. In addition VES / Choc Foot have been what I would reasonably priced for a 6hr / marathon type event around the $50, $60 per event while I can see others such as the Surfcoast 6hr being a right rip-off at $130! :mmph:



I love the idea of GMBC’s No Frills Series, and Road Criterium racing, roll up with your bike and a bidon or two, race, finish and go home. Races due to the minimal fuss, and cheap entry can be reasonably regular, they also offer entrants a chance to get out and race with minimal impact on other commitments such as family time.

 

[caad9]

The Lysterfield guys are putting together a series of 4 races on a Friday night throughout October, hopefully that gets some decent numbers.

In my opinion if the club racing scene was allowed to evolve, the bigger races could be refined and made into proper showcases at a regular interval.
The VES has been pretty good, but we started with 4 races in 8 weeks, then nothing for 6 weeks.
If we had one race every 6 or 8 weeks, the strain on families would reduce and people would have time to train themselves up between events.

Bigger sports are suffering immensely at the moment too, it's not just the relatively small cycling community with low numbers.
Thinking outside the box is going to bring fresh ideas and threads like this are essential. Just don't think we'll ever get this many promoters and clubs to agree on a system and implement it.

 

[Marx]

I have nappies to attend to.

Younger riders would jump at racing if they didn’t have to get their ‘olds’ to cart them about. What’s possible with club level racing just down from train station carparks?
Maybe shorter events, shorter courses, a little bit more madness, something different.

 

[cleeshoy]

i generally really enjoy racing once a week after work either at no frills or west agate dirt crits.

having a regular hit out keeps me in shape and i also catch up with mtes and plan a weekend ride.
since Westgate has finished I've found it hard to get fit so therefore don't feel like entering a race. And hanging out for no frills to start.

Dirt Crits is scheduled to restart this week (9 Oct), but not sure if it's going ahead?

 

[quiggs]

Just don't think we'll ever get this many promoters and clubs to agree on a system and implement it.

I'm led to believe this has been the major sticking point over recent years.

 

[The Duckmeister]

For me it's not so much the number of events to choose from, it's more about fitting things in around the two other sports I do that take up huge chunks of the year, both of which have other people reliant on me being there, so I can't just nick off on a whim to go MTB racing. It's nobody's fault but mine that I spread myself out that way, but the line has to be drawn somewhere.

 

[caad9]

I'm led to believe this has been the major sticking point over recent years.

So Tim keeps telling us!

 

[OscarWhitbread]

I think its a pretty general happening across the board in a lot of sports.

Go back 50 years and you had football in the winter and cricket in the summer, people have so much more to choose from these days so you tend to see people having a crack at different sports. I look in my garage and there's a sailing dinghy/tennis rackets/footballs/bikes/golf clubs... I have shit skills in all of them but those sports have all fitted in with what suited me at various points in my life.

 

[DP Riders]

Our small club, "DP Riders" came about last year as a result of working with Alpine Shire Planning to recognise the existing trail network and develop our "Green Season" of tourism for our Alpine Village. In a little over a year we now have a MOU with the Alpine Shire to maintain and develop the land around Dinner Plain, new trail works completed by Dirt Art and DP Riders club members, upcoming master plan for MTB with Cultural Heritage and Ecology offset, hire bikes, 40+ members and are onto our second fund raising Enduro event. All money that has been raised with an auction and our event last year has been spent on excavator hire to upgrade our trail network.
We have spoken to other event organisers to utilise the Village and developing trail network at Dinner Plain as an event location due to it's family friendly Alpine environment which is unique and relaxed.

Dinner Plain Enduro works on the idea that the prizes are randomly drawn, trophy's are won and Beer, Wine and BBQ's are free..
last year we gave away a weekend accommodation at Peppers Resort Dinner Plain with Hotham ski lift tickets as one prize and summer accommodation and wine packs also drawn out.

Cheers
DP Riders

 

[jathanas]

I think that marathon XC racing has to evolve or die. The OO numbers are testament to this.

Amateurs have less time and more options these days. Hardcore racers have 10+ full day races a year in their calendars, most have about 2 e.g. Bike Buller and FF in my case.

I've noted a move towards shorter events, and a preference to proximity. Having completed 5+ 100km events, it was easy for me to pull the pin on them. How much fun is it in the last 30km? Not much.

I agree w mmatrix. Short, sweet, & close by is much more doable on a regular basis.

 

[caad9]

Just looking at the entrants for this weekends round of the Victorian Enduro Series, it must be quite stressful for organisers having only 31 entrants, 5 days out from an event.
Interestingly, the following round in 3 weeks time at Buxton already has more entries.

I don't know what this adds to the conversation, but thought it worth noting

 

[Calvin27]

Interestingly, the following round in 3 weeks time at Buxton already has more entries.

I don't know what this adds to the conversation, but thought it worth noting

This adds that Buxton is awesome. Putting it out there, best XC trail in Vic.

 

[pistonbroke]

This adds that Buxton is awesome. Putting it out there, best XC trail in Vic.

You clearly haven't ridden Lakes Entrance then.