2007 Australian Worlds Team

[bmxbandit]

Alex is very good on his bike, and has lots of potential, but after seeing him at worlds last year he still has a long way to go be up to speed on corners, im sure he can rail a berm, but he was very awkward looking on flat turns, which is what i think Ronning is reffering too when he talk about a track being "technical".

I think he should have been selected but i can see why he wasnt, im sure if he went overseas to race atlast a couple world cups, regardles of how he went he would have been selected, just doing that shows a commitment that the powers that be are looking for.

It kind of sucks but thats just how it is, and im sure even Alex knows that.

 

[Ozza]

Sam Hills Birthday tomorow!

 

[Dozer]

It is obvious that the people who didn't make the team are disappointed, that is fair enough. It would be disappointing for the people who watch them train and race all year round to see these people just give up on the dream because they didn't get picked this time around.
Don't give up on your dreams people. If you enjoy doing what you're doing than keep on doing it! Some people won't notice what you're doing and how hard you're working but...............a lot of people will notice! Keep on pinning it.

Can people stop calling the Aussie racing scene "half arsed" please? There aresome people who put a lot of time and effort into making the best race they can available to the punters. We aren't made of money and we do the right thing wherever we can. If you don't have faith in the Aussie scene, get a VISA and show us how good you can run on the world scene.

I'm surpirsed that no one has actuall said "Fucking hell! Look at the lineup on the announced team! What a super high quality group of people we are sending overseas to represent our awesome counrty!".
Go Aussie.................world champions!

 

[barnesy]

.." Yes, Lloyd did pretty well at the last World's but that's his only real international experience."

YES, HE BEAT EVERY AUSTRALIAN THAT HAS BEEN PUT ON THIS YEARS TEAM (EXCEPT GRAVES/MADILL)

Obviously not a lot of credence is given to Oceania's as it's just us and a bunch of kiwi's who show up to get smoked Obviously not a lot of value is put in the National series because there are very few Aussie pros who take it seriously, as it's their off season.

YES BUT OCEANIAS IS A UCI EVENT WHICH IS ONE OF THE STATED CRITERIA FOR SELECTION.

YOU ALSO LEFT OUT THE NATIONAL TITLES (WHERE HE BEAT ALL THE OTHER AUSSIES ON THE TEAM AGAIN PLUS ALL OF THE VISITING RIDERS ). ...STOP DOWNPLAYING WHAT THIS GUY HAS DONE BECAUSE IT SUITS YOUR ARGUMENT.

Also, seriously, BOBCATZZ, post in English dude. If you can speak it you can write it.

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

RONNING ...CALLING THE AUSSIE SCENE "HALF ARSED" !! IS THIS THE SAME SCENE THAT GENERATED HILL, RENNIE, KOVARIK, HANNAH, GRAVES. Yeah real half arsed. I bet the rest of the World wish they had such a 'half arsed' racing scene that produces such poor quality. Now we just have to look at the half arsed Aussie MTNX scene the same way they look at the half arsed DH scene.

MTNX IS NOT DOWNHILL.

 

[Dozer]

Barnesy, Ryan is an administrator on farkin. It is his job to tell people that they should not use SMS typing etc. You're better off finding that fact out now than later..................
In this day and age of computers with spell checking, it really leaves no excuse.

 

[alchemist]

YES BUT OCEANIAS IS A UCI EVENT WHICH IS ONE OF THE STATED CRITERIA FOR SELECTION.

Um, no.

must demonstrate their ability to compete at the elite international level by attending a minimum of two (2) UCI major races (World Cup, Maxxis Cup, NORBA, French Cup, Swiss Cup, Sea Otter) in the 2007 season prior to 9 July;

While you can get UCI points at the Australian Championships and the Oceanias these are not considered major races.

PS I think your Caps Lock key is stuck​

 

[the F.H.B]

It seems a pretty simple formula to me; if you want worlds selection, get out there and prove you can mix it up at the international level. Yes, Lloyd did pretty well at the last World's but that's his only real international experience.

Obviously not a lot of credence is given to Oceania's as it's just us and a bunch of kiwi's who show up to get smoked Obviously not a lot of value is put in the National series because there are very few Aussie pros who take it seriously, as it's their off season.

Every Aussie on the team has proven over the years that they have what it takes to perform on the world stage. Lloyd, as yet, has not. Every Aussie on the team has risked a huge amount of their own money and given up a huge amount of their own time to get overseas, race and get noticed in the first place. Lloyd, as yet, has not. It's pretty obvious how the formula here works; race overseas and do well = get selected. Race in Australia and do well = not get selected.

Note that all of the Aussies with their "big dollar" rolleyes: Ha! Big money in MTB? Don't know which sport you're following) sponsors only have those sponsors because they took the risk in the first place and got themselves overseas to race. If Lloyd does that there's no doubt in my mind that he'll be in the same position in a few years time but ultimately, he has to make the first move and do something about it. No one is going to come banging down his door and shoving contracts under his nose just because he wins a few national rounds, the scene here is littered with riders with bucketloads of talent who never make the next level because they never venture beyond our shores.

Sorry Ryan, I tend to disagree with what your trying to say here. from what i've been abile to ascertain many of the top Aussie racers (information is blurry on the interweb to say the least) got their international beginnings as a result of their preformances at the world champs, Rennie, Rando etc...

Even the funding required to do a single Norba or Wc season is massive undertaking for an unsupported rider.

 

[ja_har]

Sorry Ryan, I tend to disagree with what your trying to say here. from what i've been abile to ascertain many of the top Aussie racers (information is blurry on the interweb to say the least) got their international beginnings as a result of their preformances at the world champs, Rennie, Rando etc...

Even the funding required to do a single Norba or Wc season is massive undertaking for an unsupported rider.

So if that is the case the situation seems to be that if you are in Male under 19s DH you will get support, training and help along the way to make it OS with a focus to do well at the World Champs, The focus seems to be on building future champions but if you ride at any level of MNTX, (and XC for that matter) you won't get any support at all, even from the selectors when you are willing to pay your own way when you do have the potential to make it OS.

 

[...jim]

There are a few things going on here.

Firstly, we have runs on the board over many years on DH, so yes there is likely to be more funding for that in terms of representation at World championship level than for areas in which we'll struggle. It might not be fair, but that's often how sport funding works. Add to that the fact that XC is an Olympic sport, hence sits closer to the funding heart, and you have another grey factor.

In terms of riders paying their own way, that's certainly not the only cost for CA in this. Yes, we could send a full team of 7 XC men, 7 women, 7 u23 men, etc (or whatever we're entitled to across all diciplines) but it would cost a lot just in terms of team tracksuits (add other costs like accom? support staff? transport? team site @ venue costs). I don't know what it costs over all - or how the dollars break down - but it's going to cost CA (ASC, taxpayer, etc) more than just the cost of an airfare.

So picking the team is a balancing act that not only includes talent available (both in Aust or those internationals in a position to be there with support at less cost to CA, etc) - but also where the dollars run out. Unfortunately I guess(!) it's a funding fact of life that putting eg: Rennie in the Mtnx team will cost less than Lloyd. Unfair? Injust? Anti athlete development? or mearly a practicality of the costs involved in sending a team to a WC on the other side of the world. (note: no disprespect meant to Rennie, just the first name I though of)

I'd imagine (and I really don't know) that selection starts with realistic numbers that can go - before then moving to individual selection based on the criteria, then juggling the lot. Sharples and Grundy have the expierence and the runs on the board. There is also the appeals process, there for a reason.

At the end all the people won't be happy all the time.

 

[GDonehue]

Um, no.

While you can get UCI points at the Australian Championships and the Oceanias these are not considered major races.

​

This is where there is a little bit of confusion, I would suggest. The criteria states 'races that are seen as major' - but the UCI themselves see both the Aussie National and the Oceanias as being major and or at least major enough that they attract reasonable UCI points. I am not going to argue the pros and cons of whether or not this UCI ranking is justified - the simple fact is that in the eyes of the UCI the events rank. Who decides what is major when a result at NORBA might occur on the same weekend as say a World Cup and therefore have no ranked riders.

The other issue here is that the quoted criteria states two events that will be considered that have no 4X component (the Swiss Cup and the French Cup) and are questionable. The Swiss Cup has been replaced by the Zermatt Cup and is no longer UCI ranked. Strommy and Terry went there two weeks ago and got podiums, but both would admit it was not a really class field. The French Cup has no longer got any 4X... at least that is my understanding.

We have put in an appeal for Luke - it is based on the criteria and we'll see how we go, but one thing I would think is that with this discussion happening every year it seems we need a better criteria than what we presently have.

Oh - and other than this - YES, THIS TEAM ROCKS! We will hopefully see one of the most successful teams to date, with very strong 4X & DH teams and a shot at maybe three or even four titles (Men's and Women's DH, Junior DH, Men's 4X).

 

[GDonehue]

So if that is the case the situation seems to be that if you are in Male under 19s DH you will get support, training and help along the way to make it OS with a focus to do well at the World Champs, The focus seems to be on building future champions but if you ride at any level of MNTX, (and XC for that matter) you won't get any support at all, even from the selectors when you are willing to pay your own way when you do have the potential to make it OS.

That is a bit harsh, ja_har. The juniors over there are not getting fully covered or travelling for free - they pay too. Yep, they get support - our team is letting them use our vehicles in Europe, and they get the benefit of Scott and Beggsy - but if memory serves me correctly some of the guys in years gone by have had some nice bills at the end of the trip. The XC guys and girls are part of a supported program as well, so yes 4X has been the poor cousin, but on the same token you can only spread the few dollars so far and some of the top 4X riders are part of the elite BMX program anyway (Graves and Madill and I would take a guess that Buchanan might be part of something BMX driven too).

 

[Ryan]

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

RONNING ...CALLING THE AUSSIE SCENE "HALF ARSED" !! IS THIS THE SAME SCENE THAT GENERATED HILL, RENNIE, KOVARIK, HANNAH, GRAVES. Yeah real half arsed. I bet the rest of the World wish they had such a 'half arsed' racing scene that produces such poor quality. Now we just have to look at the half arsed Aussie MTNX scene the same way they look at the half arsed DH scene.

MTNX IS NOT DOWNHILL.

Yes it does matter. Yes it is my job to highlight people who aren't up to standard. Yes, if I don't think you meet those standards you will be taking a holiday from farkin. Any other blatantly obvious questions you need answered?

I also don't think you fully understand what I'm saying about Lloyd barnesy. I agree that he's fast and one of our best up-and-coming MTNX riders, but my argument that he still hasn't proven himself at international level stands. I don't believe that this is some vast conspiracy to keep Alex out of the team and I believe 100% that once he has proven himself, he will be a shoe-in selection for many years to come. He's only 18?, 19? now. Power athletes don't even start to peak until their early 30s, that's at least 10 years of racing once he finally makes the team.

For example, Darren Pokoj has made the semi-final of a World Cup MTNX which is arguably a bigger performance than Alex's result at the worlds last year as the fields at World Cup's are usually deeper talent-wise than the World Champ MTNX field is (for reasons such as DH riders being nominated then pulling out, which IS crap in my books). Still. I'm not going to get on here and kick and scream that it's a travesty that Pokoj isn't in the worlds team because "He totally had a big result a year ago."

You are wrong about the Oceanias thing too. The selection criteria actually states that results in major international events will be considered and specifically omits the Oceanias. It does however include a 'National Champion' clause.

FHB - The guys who you say got their 'starts' as a result of their Junior World Champs results all paid their own way there as well and with considerably less support than the current crop of juniors, who are also paying their own way, are receiving. I'm almost 100% sure however that both Rennie and Rando had earned contracts on 'pro' teams before they got their Junior World Championship.

 

[scbullit]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

 

[...jim]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

Good point. If I recall correctly, the reason we had no XC women at the Rotorua Worlds was that the three female Australian Commonwealth Games team members were offered a spot, but declined.

 

[GDonehue]

You are wrong about the Oceanias thing too. The selection criteria actually states that results in major international events will be considered and specifically omits the Oceanias. It does however include a 'National Champion' clause.

Not quite right (but also not quite wrong... see a pattern of inconsistency forming?)

2.1 States that the committee will only consider results outside of Australia that are UCI registered or those mentioned in 2.4. But, note here, the actual clause is not saying they will only consider offshore events, simply that if the result is offshore it has to be a UCI event or one under 2.4. I even had my reading of this paragragh double checked - it is just not really well written, but it is clear enough to be understood.

In 2.2 we have a contradiction - it states that the cut off is 17 July (11.1 says 9 July) and then we get down to 2.4 and find an event listed that is not even taking place until 21 - 27 July (Crankworx)... we are only up to page two and already things are looking pretty wobbly.

2.3.1 is quite clear - the selection committee can consider podiums. As there has been and is nothing to suggest that these podiums are specific to 'outside Australia' events, provided the event is a Major UCI meet (as per Para 11.1) it can be considered

Para 11.1 is where all the problems really come from, and it is this paragraph that an athlete could appeal on if they were only racing here. It states that a rider must display their ability at an elite international level by attending a minimum of two UCI major races - it then goes on to list these races, but the problem is the way it is written is done more so as a way of providing examples rather than a restrictive list.

This means - and I will be as clear as possible for the cheap seats - that the Oceanias and Nationals would and should be considered as events that can be used as qualifying standards. The Nationals in particular had stronger field than any NORBA I have seen this year and craps on some of the events listed in the guide.

Likewise the Oceania's MUST be considered a major UCI race, because the UCI considers them a major event (rightly or wrongly). We actually have no choice in arguing this toss with them, regardless of who does and doesn't ride.

My biggest gripe is the event list is dodgy:
World Cup - No Probs there.
NORBA - OK, on a good non-clash day you'll get a good field, but most of the Rounds carry no UCI points.
Swiss Cup... Jesus - Are they kidding me!?
French Cup... No 4X and the points are worth less than our National Championships , so why are they listed?

Sorry to get technical above - but having just written the appeal for Strommy, I have been jumping all over this stuff for hours.

It may sound like I want the criteria relaxed - I don't. Actually I want criteria that are tougher and would make it almost impossible to appeal because it would be crystal clear. We are a long way from this yet.

 

[TS153]

Id just like to say thank you to all the people out there supporting us with the little issue that has arisen, but doubt anything will happen with it and our best bet is just to aim for next year.
I also agree with GDonehue and would like to see a clearer selection criteria, maybe even a clear scheduele of races that riders looking for selection need to turn up to so we can get a decent comparison, Rather than having riders turn up to races and only racing if they think they think they have a chance, you either race 4x or you dont, pick. If you dont go good, suck it up and go to the next.
I also think that aussie races should be included in the criteria as so far racing in europe I havent been to a race yet that I have seen a marginally higher lever of competition. And too bad if its in your "off season", your a racer, so race.
Please dont take this as im having a go about certain riders on the team as im not they are awesome riders and rode with a few of them throughout the summer.
I just want to know what I have to do to qualify and not have to turn up to every world cup as I and many others dont have the money or that kind of support behind us, and I dont want to hear again that its cheaper to send dhers that race 4x cause its cheaper or maybe we should discuss a roster where one year we send a team of 4xers that will hit up the downhill, Id give it a go, id suck but ill try you never know I mite crash up top and rolly polly my way down the hill to a podium.
Once again thank you to the people supporting us.
Terry Scarr

 

[Techno Destructo]

IN THIS AGE OF SMS SPELLING DOES IT REALLY MATTER?. IF HIS SPELLING IS ONE OF YOUR POINTS, THEN YOU HAVE VERY FEW POINTS. IF SOMEONE HAS PROBLEMS SPELLING IT'S PROBABLY NOT YOUR JOB TO HIGHLIGHT THIS. OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO REVIEW ALL PEOPLE ON FARKIN TO SEE IF THEY MEET WITH YOUR APPROVED STANDARDS OF SPELLING, VOCABULARY AND PROPER ETIQUETTE.

Uh, yeah. It's his job. And my job. And every other mod or admins job on here if we feel like doing it.

Bottom-fucking-line: If you can't handle the standards on Farkin, then LEAVE. There are plenty of other MTB websites out there. I hear www.wheel-world.net is a happenin' place... go there.

Now, your english is actually alright, apart from the shouting thing you've got going on, but don't criticize us for trying to maintain a decent standard of posting on this site. You didn't pay to be here, it's not your "right" to be here, and we've been running this site a helluva lot longer than you've ever been visiting it for.

Geez. We're so evil... demanding that people actually put some effort into their posts instead of talking like they're on a phone or they're illiterate... How dare we?

 

[Tim]

yeah it sucks... i bet every country wishes they could send 20 riders.... When it comes down to it, 4x is one of those sports... any one of the riders mentioned for selection Alex Lloyed, Luke Madill, Jared Rando, Jared Graves, Luke Strom,
Bryn Atkinson, Mick Hannah, Amiel Cavalier, Kahlan Young, Terry Scarr and maybe even Michael Ronning have the ability to win a World Champ 4x. A slipped or unclipped pedal, the ever present unfortunate T-bone, miss timeing a lip...... whatever these all have the ability for the worlds best to get knocked out first round. Fact is the selectors have to do a job, wether it is some lycra wearing roadie who decides, just because he has herd or read about one name more than another choses, or it is Sharples himself who decides... Fact is all of those riders barring 1 or 2, has beaten and been beaten by all of the above at some stage or another. I mean really even if they put all the names in a hat and pulled out the team, they would still have a great 4x team. I would have loved to see some more people make it, but i also think the team they have is great. As far as actual "4x" experience goes they have a lot of it in this team. Good luck to those appealing i hope they can change the minds, but i really think there is no use in bashing the selectors... they have a hard job.... i know i wouldn't like to pick the 4x team.

Tim

 

[shauno/hillbilly]

Was talking to Bryn Here at whistler crankworx race yesterday and he has had 2 operations and has had his rist pinned.
think he may be rite for the worlds.
also SAM HILL won the Garbanzo Dh race today by 25 seconds with 14.25 justin leov 2nd 14.59 more results asap.it has been raining for the last few days and the track was a sloppy mess but fun all the same.

shaun oc

 

[Lloyd 371]

There are a few people upset about Alex Lloyd not making the team...
Does anyone know if Alex was asked to be on the team? I am told sometimes people are asked before the team is announced and they may decline because they can't afford to go or whatever.

I was told about 3 months ago I was on the team but it wasnt for sure untill july and then I was told I didnt make it.

I've been training so hard for the worlds, I'm riding the best I ever have. I should be on the team, I've worked hard for it and now my dreams are smashed. Anyone that says I shouldnt be on the team is a F##### idiot and doesn't know the difference between a good rider and a world class rider. I came 2nd in Australia, 1st at Oceana Titles and placed best at the worlds last year. What more do I have to do to prove myself. I cant affort to do racers overseas cause I dont have much money and Im an aprentice that gets paid shit.........