While I try to find that data again (pretty sure it's in that thread that Zaf argued for a relaxation of gun laws and spat the dummy), I'll post relevant material that I find:
2020 illicit firearms report, ACIC: https://www.acic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2020-08/illicit_firearms_in_australia.pdf
This section goes directly to what I was referring to in my first post about the firearms starting life as legally owned:
THE GREY MARKET
Most grey-market firearms are unlikely to be held for the purpose of committing violent
offences; however, these firearms are unlikely to be reported as stolen if theft occurs
by criminals. Motivated criminals are more likely to be interested in using unregistered
firearms, as they are unlikely to be traceable by law enforcement agencies.
Many members of the community still possess grey-market firearms because they did
not surrender these during the 1996–97 gun buyback. Many firearm owners chose at that
time to maintain possession (albeit illegally) during the implementation of the National
Firearms Agreement.
The ACIC has received reports of thefts where both registered and unregistered firearms
were stolen; to avoid adverse police attention, the victim reported only the theft of the
registered firearms. It was during the recovery of the registered firearms that police
discovered the existence of the unregistered and unreported stolen firearms.
From footnotes: The grey market consists of illegally held longarms which should have been registered or surrendered under the 1996
National Firearms Agreement but were not. There are also a small number of black powder handguns in the grey market, which at one time were not required to be registered in some jurisdictions.
So the data above only relates to the existence of illicit firearms, not their use in gun crime. So it does not confirm my above claim. However, it does lend my claim credibility in that a significant majority of illicit firearms likely began their life as legally owned weapons - many of the longarms having become illegal due to changes in law after Port Arthur. From this point, it is not an unreasonable hypothesis that the majority of firearms used in gun related crime began their lives as legally owned weapons. The amount that exist to illegal import is almost negligible.
Might try and look for the right stats later at some point - I fear dredging through that argument with Zaf as it will only make me stupider and madder.
2020 illicit firearms report, ACIC: https://www.acic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2020-08/illicit_firearms_in_australia.pdf
- Based on available data, the ACIC conservatively estimates there are 260,000 firearms (250,000 longarms and 10,000 handguns) in the domestic illicit market.
- While it should be possible to associate all illicit firearms with diversion methods, a substantial number of firearms are untraceable and cannot be determined with any confidence to have entered the market by either means.
- According to Australian border detection figures and the FTP, illegal importation accounts for a comparatively small percentage of illicit firearms in the Australia market. Of all firearms traced by the FTP in 2015–16, only 1 per cent were identified as illegally imported. It is likely that some illicit firearms imported remain undetected at the border.
This section goes directly to what I was referring to in my first post about the firearms starting life as legally owned:
THE GREY MARKET
Most grey-market firearms are unlikely to be held for the purpose of committing violent
offences; however, these firearms are unlikely to be reported as stolen if theft occurs
by criminals. Motivated criminals are more likely to be interested in using unregistered
firearms, as they are unlikely to be traceable by law enforcement agencies.
Many members of the community still possess grey-market firearms because they did
not surrender these during the 1996–97 gun buyback. Many firearm owners chose at that
time to maintain possession (albeit illegally) during the implementation of the National
Firearms Agreement.
The ACIC has received reports of thefts where both registered and unregistered firearms
were stolen; to avoid adverse police attention, the victim reported only the theft of the
registered firearms. It was during the recovery of the registered firearms that police
discovered the existence of the unregistered and unreported stolen firearms.
From footnotes: The grey market consists of illegally held longarms which should have been registered or surrendered under the 1996
National Firearms Agreement but were not. There are also a small number of black powder handguns in the grey market, which at one time were not required to be registered in some jurisdictions.
So the data above only relates to the existence of illicit firearms, not their use in gun crime. So it does not confirm my above claim. However, it does lend my claim credibility in that a significant majority of illicit firearms likely began their life as legally owned weapons - many of the longarms having become illegal due to changes in law after Port Arthur. From this point, it is not an unreasonable hypothesis that the majority of firearms used in gun related crime began their lives as legally owned weapons. The amount that exist to illegal import is almost negligible.
Might try and look for the right stats later at some point - I fear dredging through that argument with Zaf as it will only make me stupider and madder.
