Over the weekend, I too had a close look at the trails referred to, walking with a group as well as riding. We had a close look at all the well placed rocks over the wet areas; the re-routed sections; as well as the closed off sections of deep mud.Just got back from riding the trail refered to here. What an abomination. The trail has been around for a long time and was riden by only a handful of people, it was kept pretty quiet (for good reason) and as a result it stayed in good nick with very little maintainence.
It was never a wet weather trail and people respected this. Since the backburn thousands of punters have been hitting the track rain, hail or shine and it's now a mess. Just in the past 3 weeks it seems to have taken a turn for the worst and now with this re- route ... I get the feeling it'll be the final nail in the coffin.
So, in summary, to the people who built this re-route ( and all the other new shitty trails) ... Please just stop. Find somewhere else to build. To everyone else, respect the trails, don't ride delicate trails in the wet and you will find they'll last a lot longer.
We're our own worst enemy.
(RNP rider since 92)
I find myself disheartened by this post. I will try to remain civil and constructive in my reply. I apologise in advance if my tone becomes angry or derisive, for that is certainly not my intent. It is my aim to keep this positive.Just got back from riding the trail refered to here. What an abomination. The trail has been around for a long time and was riden by only a handful of people, it was kept pretty quiet (for good reason) and as a result it stayed in good nick with very little maintainence.
It was never a wet weather trail and people respected this. Since the backburn thousands of punters have been hitting the track rain, hail or shine and it's now a mess. Just in the past 3 weeks it seems to have taken a turn for the worst and now with this re- route ... I get the feeling it'll be the final nail in the coffin.
So, in summary, to the people who built this re-route ( and all the other new shitty trails) ... Please just stop. Find somewhere else to build. To everyone else, respect the trails, don't ride delicate trails in the wet and you will find they'll last a lot longer.
We're our own worst enemy.
(RNP rider since 92)
If riders collectively started building and riding illegal trails everywhere... Worst case scenario you would likely see riders banned from National Parks, and any riders caught would be slapped with huge fines. MTB riding would be pushed to an even smaller area.Hell, if everyone started riding the illegal trails what could they do to stop you. Strength in numbers, so why accept such mundane things.
Hey Mr what the authorities in this case National parks realize that mtbers are growing in numbers and huge numbers at that and a small minority are causing conflicts. National parks do not have huge budgets when problems occur they look at how to minimize the problems and the cheapest way out and guess what is the cheapest way out of this conflict.What the authoritative bodies seem to neglect to realise is that the number of mtbers is growing and if the trails cant legally cope with the influx of new rider, illegal trails will pop up.
Sure they can try and shut a place down... Just means that the people will ride it illegally instead. We are such an over governed body in Australia yet we have the largest amount of land per capita and yet retards get upset with people are using this vast land?
It is better than the land being developed for housing etc.
Hell, if everyone started riding the illegal trails what could they do to stop you. Strength in numbers, so why accept such mundane things.
Rant over.
Maybe we should take a quick poll.
Who wants the tech climb, and who wants it to stay as a sweet descending trail?
I vote for descending.
Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2
It is very obvious, some of the cyclists are only concerned about the type of trail that has been created within only one of the re-routed sections and how it suits their riding style (nikmcc). The above quote shows no environmental responsibility for the poor quality of the wet and muddy sections of trail, which need time to dry out and recover; nor the effect these wet and muddy sections have on walkers trying to enjoy the trail. Suggesting a poll to decide on the topic and including a preferred vote is shameful.Maybe we should take a quick poll.
Who wants the tech climb, and who wants it to stay as a sweet descending trail?
I vote for descending.
Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2
This comment is thematic of something I unfortunately see time and again. You have it all wrong. True, the Menai/Lucas heights trails were shut down, but it was for a string of reasons, not just illegal trail work. Ansto were voicing liability concerns and security risks to their complex. There were motos in there, and a number of other argumments. In any case, guess what. There is now a full on MTB complex under construction there! I am involved in the project team building it. Why does everybody keep forgetting to include that in their rants? The same community that was thrown out of those Menai trails fought to claim it back and won. The govt has agreed to fund the project, complete with signage and carpark.We've already seen Lucas Heights shut down because a small group of people took it too far.
So when is this " full on MTB complex actually going to open ? From what I've heard from the new Liberal Sutherland council it ain't high on their priorities.But when it does open and masses of MTbers descend and some start cutting in new (illegal trails) and it looks like you may lose your full on MTB complex due to a selfless few don't come on here with your doom and gloom.Here's an idea. If you don't like the new 150 metre diversion, don't ride it! The old length of trail is still there. Play in the mud if its what you want, no sarcasm intended. I will ride both lines myself, depending on weather and mud. If there are a few branches in the road, just move them. Don't just write here and whinge that its now illegally blocked. The people that placed any blockages there may try to put them back I guess, but just they will get the idea once you keep clearing the path.
Illegal trail work is always going to happen in RNP, unfortunate but true. Writing about it on forums will NEVER stop it, and likely won't even reach most of those who did it. The only thing it achieves is to make the minority reading it angry and divided. If everyone posting here was interested in meeting up on this trail on a particular day and time, I would be happy to turn up and ride it with you. We could assess the trail, point out problem areas and discuss it as a group. That would be far more constructive than what is taking place right now.
This comment is thematic of something I unfortunately see time and again. You have it all wrong. True, the Menai/Lucas heights trails were shut down, but it was for a string of reasons, not just illegal trail work. Ansto were voicing liability concerns and security risks to their complex. There were motos in there, and a number of other argumments. In any case, guess what. There is now a full on MTB complex under construction there! I am involved in the project team building it. Why does everybody keep forgetting to include that in their rants? The same community that was thrown out of those Menai trails fought to claim it back and won. The govt has agreed to fund the project, complete with signage and carpark.
So enough with the doom and gloom guys. Instead of freaking out about this illegal track work and worrying over what is our fate in the RNP, perhaps we should try approaching our local NPAWS office or the local govt and voicing our interest in greater trail access within the RNP. There is a significant body of people already doing this. Join them.
It won't be rangers taking it. It will be the police probably the Mtb police based just up the road at Sutherland.Yeah you got it covered not. You might want to go and find out what happened to the motos who had there motos confiscated while riding on aboriginal land at Menai. They can also confiscate your bike riding illegally in the water catchment area plus a $10000.00 fineWhy would you let them take/confiscate your bike? They are not police, they cannot take it off you unless you hand it over. If they try to use force against you to take it you hot then with assault charges or you just make sure they don't take it off you.
You have a lot more legal rights than you give yourself credit for. Same with vehicles too, to many people just accept what a police officer tells them when in fact they are trying to weasle you out of your right to be innocent until proven guilty.
If riders collectively started building and riding illegal trails everywhere... Worst case scenario you would likely see riders banned from National Parks, and any riders caught would be slapped with huge fines. MTB riding would be pushed to an even smaller area.
Do it right. Write to you local members of parliament and council to demand more MTB trails and access. Quote IMBA sustainable trails, the obesity epidemic, the return on investment for mountain biking, proven examples of postive outcomes for MTB and community... Yes, writing letters and engaging the Govt and community is boring and slow, but it is more likely to yield positive long term results.
Bigdamo, I've unfortunately encountered your ignorance on a previous forum on this very topic. Once again, you demonstrate how little you know on the subject. I will respond for the benefit of other readers on this forum.So when is this " full on MTB complex actually going to open ? From what I've heard from the new Liberal Sutherland council it ain't high on their priorities.But when it does open and masses of MTbers descend and some start cutting in new (illegal trails) and it looks like you may lose your full on MTB complex due to a selfless few don't come on here with your doom and gloom.
So let me get this right.Bigdamo, I've unfortunately encountered your ignorance on a previous forum on this very topic. Once again, you demonstrate how little you know on the subject. I will respond for the benefit of other readers on this forum.
The Mill Creek MTB Park (aka Menai MTB Park) is the most positive MTB movement the Sutherland Shire has ever seen. It may be a slow work in progress, but it is an assured one, with the full support of the local govt and NPAWS. After the local elections late last year, there were some new appointments amongst the councillors. Yet new or re-elected, all 13 councillors were in favour of the Mill Creek MTB park when it was reviewed again after the election. The proposal was unopposed. Construction began last year, and I have been involved at most those trail build days. The council is already invested in this project, so there is no turning back for them. Council reps are present at each build day, as well as renown MTB trail advocates to oversee the construction. There is good progress already, but it is a little slow - slow because of the fact there is only one build day per month and volunteers are the main workforce there, of which there are usually 15-20 per day. There is discussion of adding more days than 1 per month to speed up the construction, but volunteers to do the building are what the time frames really hinge upon. Hopefully the number of volunteers swells in the coming months. Concreted pieces are scheduled to be helicoptered into various sections in the near future, and money has been reserved for that. At the moment, it is looking like the trail will not open until the end of the year or just after that, but if further build days are conducted and more volunteers turn up, it will expedite the project.
The Mill Creek MTB park will not need illegal additions because it will already have been built by the local MTB community to suit all their riding preferences. The council is quite open minded about the design, and happily receive input and ideas from the volunteers. Anyone who wants to build there need only turn up on a build day. I have ridden the proposed course, and the sections already built and I am really pleased at the variety of trail to be included and course layout. Plus, once the main loop is built, it has been agreed that extensions and link trails will be considered and added, allowing the community to have further say about 'new lines'.
The only real concern out there are the motos who continue to use the trails, damaging the work being done. It is a problem still being addressed.
So please, mate, quit trying to incite fear and anger by making uneducated and provocative comments. We true MTBers have enough hurdles to bypass in getting trails approved and built without people trying to bring us down from within.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all. What I'm saying is that I don't believe people will even find the need to cut new trails in Menai once the park is complete. Whereas in the RNP, on this creek trail, it has become so unrideably muddy along the part in question that the people who created this diversion saw no alternative other than to build around it. I am in favour of this new diversion for its technical merits and design, and from sparing me a slog through a flat, muddy length of trail. This would not have had to be done if this trail was included in a greater MTB trail network within the RNP and hence was accorded maintenance days.So let me get this right.
Your prepared to ride on an illegal trail/trails (even if it is only for a 150 mtrs)in another riding area(RNP) but you expect other people to ride on your trails and not cut any illegal trails because you have done such a great job designing them that no one would even consider cutting trails.EMMM
By the way the MTB trails in the Royal were built working with the local MTBing community.We had/have to work RNP maybe easier working with Sutherland council.
Spiral into entertainment!I had a feeling this thread would spiral. My instincts have proven correct.